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Greg Rucka
Ed Brubaker
Devin Grayson
A.J. Leiberman
Jeph Loeb
Judd Winick
Last edited by Pariah; 2004-05-03 5:32 PM.
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Ed Brubaker???
He writes a great catwoman and a great Batman IMO. I can't disagree with anyone else though. His writing isn't good enough to keep me reading Catwoman with Paul Gulacy's horrid artwork though. So you can have your Jim Balent Catwoman again, because the title is ruined for me anyway.
Give me a petition and I'll sign it for you.
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I didn't make the list?! I'm so disappointed.  I'm just gonna have to work harder. Piggy, get me Rucka's phone number. 
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Devin Grayson
*Laughing till I'm blue in the face* Shit man, she's been on my list for YEARS! Made the Titans look bad, Made the Bat-Man books look bad, or is she still killing yall over in Gotham?
Harsh Mistress of the Nature Boys!©
The last time someone listened to a Bush, folks wandered around in the desert for 40 years...
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Bludhaven, Gotham, same difference. She's still screwing up my favorite DCU character (tied with Flash, who has a good writer).
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Quote:
Pig Iron said:
Ed Brubaker???
He writes a great catwoman and a great Batman IMO. I can't disagree with anyone else though. His writing isn't good enough to keep me reading Catwoman with Paul Gulacy's horrid artwork though. So you can have your Jim Balent Catwoman again, because the title is ruined for me anyway.
Give me a petition and I'll sign it for you.
First, I loathe what Brubaker has done to Catwoman. I want my independent work for herself not tied down bad ass bitch with cool BALENT art work back (meaning this has nothing to do with T&A as you imply with mentioning Gulacy).
Second, I did not like Cooke's OR Gulacy's artwork. Balent is the best.
Third, he uses his writing opportunites to sympathize with minorities (like Rucka) instead of focus effort into writing great comic stories (which he couldn't do to save his life anyway).
Fourth (as I've already mentioned), I don't think the fucker can write for shit. Maybe you caught one of my many a fight with him on the DCMBs before I was kicked.
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Quote:
Grimm said:
I didn't make the list?! I'm so disappointed.
I'm just gonna have to work harder. Piggy, get me Rucka's phone number.
Did last night mean nothing to you? It wasn't just about the sex.
Now you're going to go galivanting around with that whore Rucka.
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Quote:
Princess Koriand'r said:
Quote:
Pariah said:
Devin Grayson
*Laughing till I'm blue in the face* Shit man, she's been on my list for YEARS! Made the Titans look bad, Made the Bat-Man books look bad, or is she still killing yall over in Gotham?
Did you know she wanted to make Dick Bi-sexual. Can't imagine why  (i.e., she's bi herself).
Yeah, I've been pissed off at her writing BIG TIME, but I also get pissed when people feel like including themselves in characters they didn't even make (Brubaker did this in Catwoman too).
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So you don't like Winick on Batman?
I heard that he's writing Batman how he used to be written, pre-Hush and Murderer-fugutive.
now known as rex
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I find his writing style awful. He doesn't have any skills. And one of my biggest problems with him is that he said he was going to include elements from BC and Hush in his arc, which makes absolutely no sense. Winnick is yet another fame grabbing moron.
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AJ is the guy from Gotham Knights right? Why dont you like him? The Hush thing is pretty crap seen as no fucker is willing to answer any questions, but the idea of him taking on the joker old nemesis vs new nemesis is a good idea [though i know you and your joker obsession wont think so  ] What about Mark Miller, apparently he was viciously bad mouthing the French in The Ultimates, then again, the French are Bastards....  What about McFarlane and Frank Miller too? True, Frank did write DKR but his work on Spawn/Batman should have had him tortured in front of customers at a convention. McFarlane is also a guilty party involved with that awful book, plus hes a lonely recluse nowadays Bill Jemas is somewhat of a bum wizard aswell, he was seriously bragging about raising all of Marvels prices in a hardcover about him and Queseda
"Now TV's all about format these days isn't it, and I've got a new type for you right here.
Its me and Paris Hilton driving around in a car.... Now I know what you're thinking, but she's in the boot!"
"So you see, 'Ring around the Rosey' refers to the horrible symptoms of a terrifying disease, a disease which.....a disease which....ZIM! Theres a Pigeon on you're head. You have 'Head Pigeons'. get to the Nurse before they spread to the other children."
"Get off my lawn Cookie Beast!"
--Invader Zim
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It's Mark Millaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, just pronounced Miller. Crazy scottish bastard.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
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Flamesword, Leiberman not only rammed my Harley baby into the ground, but he's doing the same with Joker. I mean, seriously! Who the fuck is stupid enough to give Joker a solid definite past?! Joker and everything about him is one of the best things that ever happened to DC. He's looking to screw that up dude. I may have a Joker obsession, but even people who aren't obsessed are carrying my tune as well. Joker is JOKER. He's not some Joe with an everyday name that personifies him as "that guy". To create a past for him is to kill him.
And yes, I also hate Frank Miller and Todd McFarlane. Both facist, hypocritical, and full of themselves. They're just not doing anything to piss me off at the moment.
Here, see:
Devin Grayson: LotDK
Ed Brubaker: Catwoman
Rucka: Death and the Maidens, Wonder Woman
Jeph Loeb: STILL pissed off about Hush, S/B
Leiberman: STILL pissed off about my beloved Harley, Gotham Knights
Winick: Idiotic enough to actually try to integrate past Batman constants with Hush and BC.
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PIggy, I just realized I misinterpreted your post a bit there (damn ADD). Sorry.
Question, what do you think of Balent over all? Do you not prefer his art on Catwomn or not prefer him at all? What What!?
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Oh, I thought you meant Joe Lieberman.....
I thought Winnick's superhero work was awful(though Barry Ween is pretty good), didn't care for the whole "Sasha" crap with Rucka's 'Tec run, and Grayson is bad fanfic disguised as a professional writing.
Brubaker's Catwoman, however, is light years better than Balent's craptacular run. Even if you don't like the book, Pariah, you have to admit he's done wonders for Catwoman's credibility. She was viewed as a T n' A character and very little else. Now the book is selling well, and Catwoman is actually taken seriously.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
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Quote:
Even if you don't like the book, Pariah, you have to admit he's done wonders for Catwoman's credibility.
Yes, I will admit that, but only because people are ignorant. I had a huge discussion over this on the DCMBs with a moron who said that he hated T&A and therefore never EVER read Balent's Catwoman. And as it turns out, this is the same thing I heard from just about everyone who said they hated the previous Catwoman. They never even tried the book out and were never educated on the fact that the covers are not the innards. Like I said before, Balent's covers are dramatizations. On the inside of the books, there are no poses she makes that resemble the ones you'd find in porn mags or movies. There are almost zero ass and tits shots. All I found was mild innuendo and partial skin showing that wasn't even focused on.
As for the writing...Well, that's your opinion Animalman. But one of my points was the fact that people never focused on it at all and took Balent's women for face value. This goes especially for the people who got paid to read and review these books. All anyone told me was that they had zero tolerance for Selina's figure and that the writing was always in the background. Opinion or not, I know for a fact that's not true. These may be COMIC books, but it seems to me that writing should be of more importance, so I find this lip-service a bit fishy.
She has credibility, but only because people feel like judging a book by its cover. And to be a bit more succinctly, I have no respect for people who jump on the PC band-wagon.
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I don't think it's about being PC, I think it's about wanting to read an interesting character, not just ogle over a cartoon drawing. I read the Catwoman book for years, and yes, I do think it was TnA. The covers were a lot like the inside of the book, in that the major focus was clearly on Catwoman patrolling around with huge breasts in a skintight suit. I'm sure a big reason why some label Balent as a TnA artist is because of his other work....
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
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Animalman, we've been over this, Selina has nothing in the breasts department when compared to the characters of Tarot. Balent respected Selina's character and did not go over the top. And as I said before, I didn't see any sort of correlation with the covers that contained Selina's augmented figure and the insides of the book with a more consistent and realable size. I did not see any of her books that constantly had panels with her showing off her T&A for no reason at all. If ever anyone was distracted by her body, it would be because they decided to look. If you get a book to read, then read it, just because some people oggle doesn't mean you should complain about it and start oggling yourself just to scrutinize (I mean "you" in the general term).
I repeat: The book was neither meant by the writers (maybe the last one.....What'shisname), nor made by Balent to have Selina's anatomy be distracting.
And I realize that what the reviewers SAY has nothing to do with being PC. But I'm stating that they're full of shit and they really ARE being PC.
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I actually have to agree with him here in regards to Balent's art. Much of the fuss that was made over her figure was melodramatic and silly.
The writing and characterization, however, was very inconsistent, with constant changeovers from Duffy to Dixon to Moench, and each time somebody came on, they immediately tried to clarify the character's past to fit their take and made a big, murky mess. After a while, it really seemed the only reason to have the book around was to have something for Balent to draw.
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You are a fucking moron Pariah.
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Quote:
Grimm said:
The writing and characterization, however, was very inconsistent, with constant changeovers from Duffy to Dixon to Moench, and each time somebody came on, they immediately tried to clarify the character's past to fit their take and made a big, murky mess. After a while, it really seemed the only reason to have the book around was to have something for Balent to draw.
Sadly, I must concur with this. While I did enjoy the past Catwoman with the different writers, she changed a bit too much not to notice.
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Quote:
woodstock said:
You are a fucking moron Pariah.
Whazah? Woozle wuzzle? Zuh? What?
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I hate Gulacy..except during the kung fu and some of his indy stuff. I have learned to appreciate artsist like Cooke after years of liking "hot" artists. I appreciate every aspect of comic art now...framing, pacing, backgrounds, design, line thickness, etc. I used to not like Kirby, but now I understand-sure he was quick, but look at someone like pascual ferry and then look at some of Kirby's work....no contest.Kirby is superior when you break his art down. Everyone has their own taste-if someone likes ferry's art, great. I try to look at technical aspects, but I also still have to like it. It's only in the past 15-20 years that I "discovered" artists like Joe Kubert, Alex toth, Kurt Schaffenberger, Lou Fine, etc. It's hard for me to look at modern artists work now without finding the art distracting to the story...like Gulacy.
Now Balent. His stuff is too angular and rigid. there is no life in his art. I don't like his faces or bodies and I don't like his line depth. I love cheesecake-naturally I should like Balent..I just see that Dave Stevens, Brian Bolland, Adam Hughes, Terry Dodson and several others do it better.
That said I think the Jim Balent of 10 years ago is better than the Balent of Today.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Animalman, we've been over this
Yeah, I know, but you're the one that keeps starting "I hate these guys!" threads.
Since I can't read Jim Balent's mind, I'll revise:
The book appeared to be little more than TnA, and from my experience, having been in comic shops(working in one for a bit) and at comic conventions, for years, it appeared that was the main appeal to it's readers.
Alterantively, when I saw current Catwoman readers at shops, conventions or message boards, and discussed with them why they liked the current Catwoman book, it became clear that this was a much different crowd. I even saw women reading the book, something I saw very, very little of from Balent's Catwoman.
As for the PC thing, I'm sure that has something to do with it in a few cases, in reviews.....but how many people are going to buy a book every month just to come off as politically correct?
I have no problem with cheesecake stuff, it has it's place in comics and I'm fine with that....I just think there are guys in comics that do it better than Balent does. Adam Hughes, Terry Dodson, etc.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
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Isn't there an issue of that comic that takes place in a female prision... with shower scene included?
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The only thing worse than Grayson's writing, is the "Devin Grayson Story".
Turns out she was watching an episode of The Batman Animated Series, decided she wanted to be a writer, pestered the Hell out of another waste, Denny O' Neil, and then get a regular writing gig since she never missed a deadline.
"Are you eating it...or is it eating you?" [center] ![[Linked Image from i13.photobucket.com]](http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a275/captainsammitch/boards/banners/blogban3.jpg) [/center] [center] ![[Linked Image from i13.photobucket.com]](http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a275/captainsammitch/boards/banners/jlamiska.jpg) [/center]
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She was going out with Mark Waid for a while, I thought that was how she got into "the business".....
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
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Quote:
I'm Not Mister Mxypltk said:
Isn't there an issue of that comic that takes place in a female prision... with shower scene included?
PLEASE DROP THE SOAP!
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That's how the first issue of "100 Bullets" started out. HOT
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Quote:
MisterJLA said:
The only thing worse than Grayson's writing, is the "Devin Grayson Story".
Turns out she was watching an episode of The Batman Animated Series, decided she wanted to be a writer, pestered the Hell out of another waste, Denny O' Neil, and then get a regular writing gig since she never missed a deadline.
1) Attraction to a fictional character
2) Writes things not very well
3) Wanted to make said fictional charadter bisexual.
She IS a fan fiction writer... that's fucked up. But I'd tap that.
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Nah, you could get better, Disco....
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
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Quote:
MisterJLA said:
The only thing worse than Grayson's writing, is the "Devin Grayson Story".
Turns out she was watching an episode of The Batman Animated Series, decided she wanted to be a writer, pestered the Hell out of another waste, Denny O' Neil, and then get a regular writing gig since she never missed a deadline.
Yeah, sucks when Talent means NOTHING but being on time is EVERYTHING. Too bad I have to save my sniper attack for Bush or I'd do her--
IN
Maybe I'll stop writing porn and give this comic shit a try, just so I can scare the hell out of a few people.
Harsh Mistress of the Nature Boys!©
The last time someone listened to a Bush, folks wandered around in the desert for 40 years...
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Quote:
Disco Steve said:
Quote:
MisterJLA said:
The only thing worse than Grayson's writing, is the "Devin Grayson Story".
Turns out she was watching an episode of The Batman Animated Series, decided she wanted to be a writer, pestered the Hell out of another waste, Denny O' Neil, and then get a regular writing gig since she never missed a deadline.
1) Attraction to a fictional character
2) Writes things not very well
3) Wanted to make said fictional charadter bisexual.
She IS a fan fiction writer... that's fucked up. But I'd tap that.
Now that's some funny shit. Being a fanfiction writer myself and knowing hundeds of them as well, I can say with total honestly that she couldn't write good fanfiction if she tried. Hell, Jay Faeber (Another one of Devins stepping stones/flunkie/best friend) tired to write fanfiction at the Titans Lair site and that shit sucked ass. That let me know what his writing style was garbage. Imagine how pissed I was when he got the book?
Ugh
Still, I would have been half way happy if she had at least as much skill as some of the more less talented fanfiction writers. At least the book would have has some orginality and not ended up as a Devin Greyson wet dream fantasy.
Last edited by Princess Koriand'r; 2004-05-07 3:13 AM.
Harsh Mistress of the Nature Boys!©
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Quote:
Yeah, I know, but you're the one that keeps starting "I hate these guys!" threads.
Guilty as charged. 
Quote:
The book appeared to be little more than TnA, and from my experience, having been in comic shops(working in one for a bit) and at comic conventions, for years, it appeared that was the main appeal to it's readers.
Alterantively, when I saw current Catwoman readers at shops, conventions or message boards, and discussed with them why they liked the current Catwoman book, it became clear that this was a much different crowd.
While not really agreeing with you, I'll accept this. But...
Quote:
I even saw women reading the book, something I saw very, very little of from Balent's Catwoman.
I'm unable to concur with this.
Maybe I just got a comparably large number of women in my shop buying the Balent book as opposed to other locations. But either way, I could hardly call the number of women who read it "very little". I will say that most of those women weren't exactly looking for more than Selina kicking ass though.
Quote:
As for the PC thing, I'm sure that has something to do with it in a few cases, in reviews.....but how many people are going to buy a book every month just to come off as politically correct?
Well, I can't really account for that, but I noticed an extremely large number of people on the Catwoman message boards (roughly 95%) who complained about the book sucking so damn much but at the same time, admitting that they bought the ENTIRE Balent run.
I see two reasons for this myself, which are indeed PC:
1) Because they just wanted to see a woman as the main character of a comicbook (EXACTLY like the people in the Wondy boards).
2) Because they wanted to complain about a girl's tits being too big--Which is pretty much what they do all the time (again: EXACTLY like the people in the Wondy boards).
Quote:
I have no problem with cheesecake stuff, it has it's place in comics and I'm fine with that....I just think there are guys in comics that do it better than Balent does. Adam Hughes, Terry Dodson, etc.
I hold them all at equally high standards myself, but I do have one question for you...
What exactly contrasts this Catwoman...
and this one?
IYO of course.
The only thing I can say that's a bit of a downer about balent myself is that he avoids shadowing a lot. Not to say he doesn't do it, but it's like he avoids panel angles that would call for it. Not that I blame him.
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Quote:
britneyspearsatemyshorts said:
animalman you sly minx!
Heh.
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Quote:
Princess Koriand'r said:
Quote:
Pariah said:
Devin Grayson
*Laughing till I'm blue in the face* Shit man, she's been on my list for YEARS! Made the Titans look bad, Made the Bat-Man books look bad, or is she still killing yall over in Gotham?
This whole thread just demonstrates why I love Kori so much...
Knutreturns said: Spoken like the true Greatest RDCW Champ!
All hail King Snarf!
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Quote:
Pariah said:
What exactly contrasts this Catwoman...
and this one?
IYO of course.
To me, the first one looks much better. The detail, the texture, anatomically it's extremely well drawn, though it's clearly a "model" Catwoman, not an "athlete" Catwoman(a distinction I don't think Balent was able to make in his portrayal).
If the lower one is Balent, I'll admit, it's less disproportionate than I remember his work being.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 956
500+ posts
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500+ posts
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 956 |
after laughing for quite a while at the 'You are a Fucking Moron' post and seeing the ugly monkey face next to it, i'll agree
Defining Jokers origin is a herondous thing to do, even seeing that the Joker supposedly has a book with pics of his wife in and actually remember his past life was disgraceful. Like you wwere saying with the T+A Balent covers though, dont judge a comic by the cover and the review, though its already clear hes gonna 'delve' into the past, he might not Fuck it up as much as you think
Heres my add ons to the list:
Joe Kelly. Loved his Deadpool run from start to finish, except ofcourse the finish... T-Ray stalked and ruined deadpools life completely, and he even defeated him and left him for dead in the snow at the end of #13. Though the change in events was disorientating [T-Ray didnt kill Deadpool before Deadpool and his wife, Deadpool killed T-ray before T-rays wife and the traume made him forget and think he was 'Wade Wilson', T-Rays real name]
Anyway, T-Ray didnt get any licks in, in the final battle, deadpool wasnt even that pissed off, and then he had T-Ray dissapear wife his newly empowered wife, who coincedentally, he brought back to torture and torment Deadpool with by making him think she was his wife
T-Ray should have been killed in some horrific and dramatic battle, instead 'Pools nemesis simply vanished and he made out with 'Death'
Despite his wicked run on JLA, he has to go in.. well, maybe not, but it was worth mentioning
Preist. Heard great things about his writing, except all his stories take so fucking long to reach fruition! I was reading black Panther and Deadpool one after another and i still found it somewhat boring and annoying to have absolutely no answers, i cant even imagine what it would be like to be collecting the title month after month... Was a funny issue of Deadpool where he was recruited into the frightful four, bombed the wrong airport, beat the Wizard to near death with a gun while in mid-air, then found himself running for his life from the Thing though
"Now TV's all about format these days isn't it, and I've got a new type for you right here.
Its me and Paris Hilton driving around in a car.... Now I know what you're thinking, but she's in the boot!"
"So you see, 'Ring around the Rosey' refers to the horrible symptoms of a terrifying disease, a disease which.....a disease which....ZIM! Theres a Pigeon on you're head. You have 'Head Pigeons'. get to the Nurse before they spread to the other children."
"Get off my lawn Cookie Beast!"
--Invader Zim
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 956
500+ posts
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500+ posts
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 956 |
Quote:
Animalman said:
Crazy scottish bastard.
Is animal calling me a crazy Scottish Bastard??? I wont retract my Chris Preist comment but i did read a further 2 issues of Deadpool, and some parts were a bit more funnier, like the fact that the Mercenary 'Constrictor' is actually a whiny baby who wears glasses in his civilian ID, and dont even get me started on the midget with a beard who talks like Wolverine....
"Now TV's all about format these days isn't it, and I've got a new type for you right here.
Its me and Paris Hilton driving around in a car.... Now I know what you're thinking, but she's in the boot!"
"So you see, 'Ring around the Rosey' refers to the horrible symptoms of a terrifying disease, a disease which.....a disease which....ZIM! Theres a Pigeon on you're head. You have 'Head Pigeons'. get to the Nurse before they spread to the other children."
"Get off my lawn Cookie Beast!"
--Invader Zim
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