|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896
10000+ posts
|
OP
10000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896 |
I wanted to severely injure someone seeing the advertisement for Assault on Precint 13...and yesterday, as I was looking through IMDB, I found out there's a planned remake for Scanners. This is just getting absurd. What is really accomplished with all these remakes?
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1
living in 1962 15000+ posts
|
|
living in 1962 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1 |
Why should they when remakes and sequels are making them assloads of money?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896
10000+ posts
|
|
OP
10000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896 |
Do you think Assault on Precinct 13 will make assloads of money?
I don't.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1
living in 1962 15000+ posts
|
|
living in 1962 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1 |
Assault on Precint 13 may or may not. But it's happening constantly. Look at Dawn of the Dead or Ocean's 11. Remakes are big box office and that's the bottom line the mainstream assembly line film industry.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 47,810 Likes: 2
Hip To Be Square 15000+ posts
|
|
Hip To Be Square 15000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 47,810 Likes: 2 |
All the time people go to see these remakes,the more Hollywood will make.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896
10000+ posts
|
|
OP
10000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896 |
Quote:
Grimm said:
Assault on Precint 13 may or may not. But it's happening constantly. Look at Dawn of the Dead or Ocean's 11. Remakes are big box office and that's the bottom line the mainstream assembly line film industry.
Dawn of the Dead wasn't that successful. A little over $58 million in domestic gross, just barely in the top 50 this year(significantly behind movies like White Chicks and Aliens vs. Predator.
Obvious cases excluded, I'm not sure I buy the idea that remakes make more money, simply because they're remakes.
Oceans Eleven made money because it had an All-Star cast, the hottest director in the business right now, and it was marketed extremely well.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1
living in 1962 15000+ posts
|
|
living in 1962 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
Animalman said:
Quote:
Grimm said:
Assault on Precint 13 may or may not. But it's happening constantly. Look at Dawn of the Dead or Ocean's 11. Remakes are big box office and that's the bottom line the mainstream assembly line film industry.
Dawn of the Dead wasn't that successful. A little over $58 million in domestic gross, just barely in the top 50 this year(significantly behind movies like White Chicks and Aliens vs. Predator.
And yet, it made enough money that it spawned a renewed interest in George Romero and his films. After Dawn hit, companies jumped on a "sequel" to his original Day of the Dead (don't ask, it's gonna suck) and his deals that he was already working on fell into place because companies saw that DOTD was financially viable. Whether you liked the movie or not, it was a success.
Evil Dead is also slated for a remake, because somebody somewhere thinks it will make a shitload of money. Money is the bottom line here.
Quote:
Obvious cases excluded, I'm not sure I buy the idea that remakes make more money, simply because they're remakes.
Good, because that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that Hollywood is making them, because they're successful. When they stop making money, they'll stop making them.
Quote:
Oceans Eleven made money because it had an All-Star cast, the hottest director in the business right now, and it was marketed extremely well.
And it was also a remake. And now they've remade the remake with a sequel. Which just proves my point. Remakes are big box office, and that's why they're being made.
Wasn't your point that you wanted to see something other than these types of films from Hollywood?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896
10000+ posts
|
|
OP
10000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896 |
Quote:
Grimm said:
And yet, it made enough money that it spawned a renewed interest in George Romero and his films. After Dawn hit, companies jumped on a "sequel" to his original Day of the Dead (don't ask, it's gonna suck) and his deals that he was already working on fell into place because companies saw that DOTD was financially viable.
There are zombie movies coming out all the time, many of which are based on or inspired by George Romero. Really, Dawn of the Dead wasn't even the most popular zombie movie of this past year; Shaun of the Dead was.
Besides, being a critical success(which I think, compared to many previous zombie films, you could argue DotD was) isn't the same as making a lot of money, which I believe was the argument you were making.
Quote:
And it was also a remake. And now they've remade the remake with a sequel. Which just proves my point.
It didn't need to be a remake. That cast, that director, that kind of story(given the success of other "hip" crime flicks, like Get Shorty, Out of Sight, etc), a movie with all that is going to make money.
Which brings me back to my point. Why not try to do something original? What is the the reason for doing a remake? Money isn't an answer, because a project with those parts is going to make money anyway. There has to be another reason.
Quote:
Remakes are big box office
I disagree. Movies with the right parts are big box office. Being a remake or not is rarely a factor.
Afterall, what's the target audience of a movie like Oceans Eleven? Males, age 18-35, sound about right? How many of those are even going to know Oceans Eleven is a remake? It's a 40 year old movie.
Quote:
Wasn't your point that you wanted to see something other than these types of films from Hollywood?
Yes, yes it was. Frankly, I'm sick of them. I think they're just another example of the rapid deterioration of originality and innovation in the movie business. Interesting, thought-provoking, worthwhile films are being passed over by big movie companies in favor of mindless schlock, and the few creative ideas left are recyled again and again, watered down and reused ad nauseam.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 16,240
Kisser Of John Byrne Ass 15000+ posts
|
|
Kisser Of John Byrne Ass 15000+ posts
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 16,240 |
How long has it been since there has been a good, original horror film? Or an actual scary one?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 24,593
Timelord. Drunkard. 15000+ posts
|
|
Timelord. Drunkard. 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 24,593 |
A-man, I agree with your point that Hollywood needs to concentrate on more original and better movies; but it's Hollywood. They're going to do what makes them money; and, as Grimm has said, remakes bring them in the cash. Maybe you don't think Dawn of the Dead did impressive at the box office, but the studios do. It opened at #1 pushing out Mel Gibson's The Passion from the top spot. Another horror remake debuted at #1 also. It was called The Texas Chainsaw Massacre. Starsky and Hutch also pulled in decent money. These films weren't released during the Summer Blockbuster season either. They all came out before April. A $58 mill. gross compared to a $26 mill. budget and estimated $20 mill. marketing (I will save my rant on how this is an overly inflated number due to Hollywood creative accounting practices) gives this film a $12 mill. profit. In Hollywood anytime a movie makes a profit, it's considered a big success. They were also part of a trend of theater attendance growth. More people went and saw Dawn of the Dead than they did the #1 movie a year prior. So, yes, remakes do make money. A lot of money.
whomod said: I generally don't like it when people decide to play by the rules against people who don't play by the rules. It tends to put you immediately at a disadvantage and IMO is a sign of true weakness. This is true both in politics and on the internet." Our Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man said: "no, the doctor's right. besides, he has seniority."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1
living in 1962 15000+ posts
|
|
living in 1962 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
thedoctor said:
A-man, I agree with your point that Hollywood needs to concentrate on more original and better movies; but it's Hollywood. They're going to do what makes them money; and, as Grimm has said, remakes bring them in the cash. Maybe you don't think Dawn of the Dead did impressive at the box office, but the studios do. It opened at #1 pushing out Mel Gibson's The Passion from the top spot. Another horror remake debuted at #1 also. It was called The Texas Chainsaw Massacre. Starsky and Hutch also pulled in decent money. These films weren't released during the Summer Blockbuster season either. They all came out before April. A $58 mill. gross compared to a $26 mill. budget and estimated $20 mill. marketing (I will save my rant on how this is an overly inflated number due to Hollywood creative accounting practices) gives this film a $12 mill. profit. In Hollywood anytime a movie makes a profit, it's considered a big success. They were also part of a trend of theater attendance growth. More people went and saw Dawn of the Dead than they did the #1 movie a year prior. So, yes, remakes do make money. A lot of money.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 24,593
Timelord. Drunkard. 15000+ posts
|
|
Timelord. Drunkard. 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 24,593 |
That's what I'm sayin'.
Literally.
whomod said: I generally don't like it when people decide to play by the rules against people who don't play by the rules. It tends to put you immediately at a disadvantage and IMO is a sign of true weakness. This is true both in politics and on the internet." Our Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man said: "no, the doctor's right. besides, he has seniority."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1
living in 1962 15000+ posts
|
|
living in 1962 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
Animalman said:
Quote:
Grimm said:
And yet, it made enough money that it spawned a renewed interest in George Romero and his films. After Dawn hit, companies jumped on a "sequel" to his original Day of the Dead (don't ask, it's gonna suck) and his deals that he was already working on fell into place because companies saw that DOTD was financially viable.
There are zombie movies coming out all the time, many of which are based on or inspired by George Romero. Really, Dawn of the Dead wasn't even the most popular zombie movie of this past year; Shaun of the Dead was.
Yes, Shaun of the Dead is likely the most popular and possibly the best of the bunch so far. But it wasn't released in America for at least a year, and still hasn't been released in several countries. And still didn't get theatrical release in several places in states.
The DOTD remake, along with the TCM remake, and all the J-horror remakes such as The Ring and The Grudge, are all part of the current trend in Hollywood. Remakes are easy to make, because they don't require a lot of thought, and pulling in assloads of money. That's why Hollywood likes them.
Quote:
Besides, being a critical success(which I think, compared to many previous zombie films, you could argue DotD was) isn't the same as making a lot of money, which I believe was the argument you were making.
Yes, it did make an assload of money. Just because it's not at Titanic or Passion level, doesn't mean it didn't. Read the doctor's post where he breaks it down. I quoted and highlighted it as well.
Quote:
It didn't need to be a remake. That cast, that director, that kind of story(given the success of other "hip" crime flicks, like Get Shorty, Out of Sight, etc), a movie with all that is going to make money.
No, it didn't need to be a remake. Yet it was. And no one can predict what type of movies will be hits. Ishtar is probably the most famous example of a "sure thing" bombing. .
Quote:
Which brings me back to my point. Why not try to do something original? What is the the reason for doing a remake? Money isn't an answer, because a project with those parts is going to make money anyway. There has to be another reason.
No, there is no other big reason. It's Hollywood. They're a business. Money is the bottom line. As I've stated before, remakes don't require lots of thought, and they're pulling in cash. So instead of taking risks, they're going the safe way. That's what big businesses do.
Quote:
I disagree. Movies with the right parts are big box office. Being a remake or not is rarely a factor.
You don't even have an argument here. This statement is your opinion. Hipness doesn't guarantee success, nor does the "right parts." You can cast actors in what someone might conceive as the "right parts" all day long. But if those "right parts" aren't what people want to see, then you're fucked.
Quote:
Afterall, what's the target audience of a movie like Oceans Eleven? Males, age 18-35, sound about right? How many of those are even going to know Oceans Eleven is a remake? It's a 40 year old movie.
It doesn't matter whether they know it's a remake or not. The fact is that it is a remake and was successful. So the trend continues.
Quote:
Yes, yes it was. Frankly, I'm sick of them. I think they're just another example of the rapid deterioration of originality and innovation in the movie business. Interesting, thought-provoking, worthwhile films are being passed over by big movie companies in favor of mindless schlock, and the few creative ideas left are recyled again and again, watered down and reused ad nauseam.
I actually agree with you. I don't like what they're doing. But I understand why they do it.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
|
|
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308 |
I think someone is trying to pull a MOTA.
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896
10000+ posts
|
|
OP
10000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896 |
Quote:
thedoctor said:
Maybe you don't think Dawn of the Dead did impressive at the box office, but the studios do. It opened at #1 pushing out Mel Gibson's The Passion from the top spot.
I'm not sure what you mean by that.
According to this, Passion made more in its opening than Dawn of the Dead made total.
They were also released nearly a month apart.
I don't know how reliable these sites are, though.
Quote:
Another horror remake debuted at #1 also. It was called The Texas Chainsaw Massacre.
I would say TCM was one of the exceptions(I did say there were exceptions in my initial post).
Quote:
Starsky and Hutch also pulled in decent money.
Not to be nitpicky, but Starsky and Hutch was based on a TV show. It wasn't a remake of another movie. So, I wasn't counting it(and, either way, I think with the cast it had, it was going to have a pretty good chance at making a lot of money anyway).
Quote:
More people went and saw Dawn of the Dead than they did the #1 movie a year prior.
Really? According to what?
Quote:
Grimm said:
The DOTD remake, along with the TCM remake, and all the J-horror remakes such as The Ring and The Grudge, are all part of the current trend in Hollywood. Remakes are easy to make, because they don't require a lot of thought, and pulling in assloads of money. That's why Hollywood likes them.
Well, again, I don't think the fact that The Ring or the The Grudge were remakes were the reason they sold so well. I don't think most people knew anything about the Japanese movies.
Quote:
You don't even have an argument here. This statement is your opinion.
....of course it's my opinion. A lot of what's been said in this thread are just that; opinions.
This is an opinionated discussion, is it not?
Quote:
Hipness doesn't guarantee success, nor does the "right parts." You can cast actors in what someone might conceive as the "right parts" all day long. But if those "right parts" aren't what people want to see, then you're fucked.
Well, sure, nobody knows for sure whether or not a movie is going to succeed. Remaking a movie doesn't change that.
Quote:
I actually agree with you. I don't like what they're doing. But I understand why they do it.
I understand that they think remakes equal money. I just don't agree that that's true. As you pointed out, that is my opinion.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 47,810 Likes: 2
Hip To Be Square 15000+ posts
|
|
Hip To Be Square 15000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 47,810 Likes: 2 |
Now one thing you have said Animalman shows exactly why your argument will never win.
You have said on several occasions that certain films are not known to be remakes because the original is either old or foreign.
That is why they are remade.
The target audience for big blockbuster movies is as you say a late teen to mid thirties audience.
This audience would rather see a new film than an old film so Hollywood takes a tried and tested formula & remakes it,updating it for the modern audience.
And as for the all star cast for Oceans 11.
Of course an all star cast is gonna have more chance of selling,thats why people sign big stars to movies.
I'm betting though there have been films with all star casts that havent been big hits as well.
Nothing is guarenteed!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,030
6000+ posts
|
|
6000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,030 |
Maybe all the great stories have been told by screenwriters.
Look at these interest-getting films...
FINDING NEVERLAND (biopic)
KINSEY (biopic)
THE AVIATOR (biopic)
BEYOND THE SEA (mostly biopic)
Super-hero movies are becoming a rage again. Movies adapted from another medium. IOW, stories somebody esle has already come up with.
HARRY POTTER
STAR WARS
LORD OF THE RINGS
Hollywood seem to me to be looking elsewhere for stories to cinematize.
Last edited by Jim Jackson; 2005-01-04 6:28 PM.
We all wear a green carnation.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896
10000+ posts
|
|
OP
10000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896 |
Quote:
Nowhereman said:
Now one thing you have said Animalman shows exactly why your argument will never win.
You have said on several occasions that certain films are not known to be remakes because the original is either old or foreign.
That is why they are remade.
I don't really have as much of a problem with Americanizing foreign movies(though rarely are the results good, in my opinion). I find it interesting to observe similar storylines placed in different cultural settings. There you see the way certain social idioms alter and distort the way certain actions or results are perceived. It's sort of a way of identifying how different(or how alike) we are from other cultures.
At least it's not reusing something that's already been shown in American cinema.
Quote:
And as for the all star cast for Oceans 11.
Of course an all star cast is gonna have more chance of selling,thats why people sign big stars to movies.
I'm betting though there have been films with all star casts that havent been big hits as well.
Nothing is guarenteed!
This is true, and I belive I intimated as much in one of my previous posts.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1
living in 1962 15000+ posts
|
|
living in 1962 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 19,546 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
Not to be nitpicky
That's a joke, right?
Quote:
Well, again, I don't think the fact that The Ring or the The Grudge were remakes were the reason they sold so well. I don't think most people knew anything about the Japanese movies.
And as I said before about Ocean's 11 and Assault on Precint 13, it doesn't matter whether the audiences know anything about the previous films.
Quote:
....of course it's my opinion. A lot of what's been said in this thread are just that; opinions.
This is an opinionated discussion, is it not?
Yes, it is. But you're ignoring facts placed directly in front of you to carry on with your opinion.
Quote:
I understand that they think remakes equal money. I just don't agree that that's true. As you pointed out, that is my opinion.
How can you disagree with facts, Ani? I know you're a fairly smart kid, but you're off in your own world here.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 47,810 Likes: 2
Hip To Be Square 15000+ posts
|
|
Hip To Be Square 15000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 47,810 Likes: 2 |
Another thing to consider is that remakes are not new.
The magnificent seven was a remake or The seven samurai.
There were god knows how many Dracula/Frankenstein/Wolfman/Mummy/Invisible man remakes.
The Thing was a remake.
Never say never again was a remake.
Its nothing new,just more widespread now.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 16,240
Kisser Of John Byrne Ass 15000+ posts
|
|
Kisser Of John Byrne Ass 15000+ posts
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 16,240 |
No one answered my question..you are all nitpicking...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896
10000+ posts
|
|
OP
10000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896 |
Quote:
Grimm said:
But you're ignoring facts placed directly in front of you to carry on with your opinion.
Quote:
How can you disagree with facts, Ani? I know you're a fairly smart kid, but you're off in your own world here.
If you'd be so kind as to elaborate on what facts I'm ignoring.
I'm not arguing with the fact that there are a lot of remakes now making money(primarily because there are a lot more remakes now), I'm arguing with the suggestion that the movies are making money because they're remakes.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896
10000+ posts
|
|
OP
10000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 14,896 |
Quote:
Nowhereman said:
Its nothing new,just more widespread now.
A lot more widespread. So widespread, infact, that Hollywood is remaking movies that weren't even that good to beginwith(Thomas Crown Affair was decent, but not one of McQueen's better movies).
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,289
2000+ posts
|
|
2000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,289 |
I would rather see movies than were not that great remade than the classics.
Take good ideas that were badly executed and make good films from them, then you are doing something useful.
why remake a film like Planet of the Apes, where the first was great? You will almost certainly fail to top it.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 47,810 Likes: 2
Hip To Be Square 15000+ posts
|
|
Hip To Be Square 15000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 47,810 Likes: 2 |
I think its to appeal to the current audience.
A lot of todays audience cannot abide watching old(er) films.
A movie like Planet of the apes is definetley gonna appeal to new audiences because the special effects,the old films special effects would,to the new audience that is,look dated!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,680
1500+ posts
|
|
1500+ posts
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,680 |
It's a rented tux ok? I'm not going comando in another man's fatigues.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,326
1000+ posts
|
|
1000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,326 |
Quote:
Animalman said:
Quote:
Nowhereman said:
Its nothing new,just more widespread now.
A lot more widespread. So widespread, infact, that Hollywood is remaking movies that weren't even that good to beginwith(Thomas Crown Affair was decent, but not one of McQueen's better movies).
Actually, the movies they're remaking SHOULD be the ones that weren't that good to begin with. A lot of times, the originals had interesting ideas that were just done really, really badly. A good remake can take those concepts and spin them into something genuinely good and entertaining.
One movie that I would love to see remade is Xanadu. Greek muse falls in love with an artist and wins him over by making his dreams come true, only to face a culture clash when her Greek god parents butt in. In the existing film, it's played as dead-serious sap, and it sucks. But the premise, if done right, would make for a terrific Chuck Jones-style comedy. It could still be a musical, but the story could be tightened up and played for humor, and it would be much better than the original.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,680
1500+ posts
|
|
1500+ posts
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,680 |
I agree to an extent. I say that because I think about what Caroline Grimes said about It's a Wonderful Life and how it bombed when it was released. What happened after that was it sat on a shelf for years until the copy right expired and they forgot to renew it, so it then became public domain and was shown on every channel for years. It became a hit as a result.
Now on the other hand, take something like Man from U.N.C.L.E. cool spy show in the 60s, had all the potential of being the Alias of it's time, but was limited due to budget and technology of the times. Now it would be even cooler than it was back then and it's in the works of being made into a movie. See my thread for more information on this.
It's a rented tux ok? I'm not going comando in another man's fatigues.
|
|
|
|
|
