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I agree. In fact, I think that's why I'd like to see Dick as Batman - just to see how he'd play it. Batman actually went to lengths to ensure that Dick wouldn't become like him - acting as a father figure, etc. - so it's impossible that Dick be exactly like Bruce. Honestly, I just think it'd be interesting to see...
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as I said, room for exploration and growth, as well as a place for new readers to jump in. as they did with Wally West's Flash, Kyle Rayner's GL, and Connor Hawke's GA. (GA here means Green Arrow for you smartarses.  )
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To be honest, I prefer the younger versions of those characters to the newer ones. Wally, Kyle, and Connor were always more interesting to me than Barry, Hal, and Ollie.
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Quote:
Grimm said:
(GA here means Green Arrow for you smartarses. )
I KNEW IT!
Ha!
 Dear, sweet Harley Kwink...I'm madly in love with you. Marry me! We can go to Canadia. Or Boston or something. It'll be grand...You know the cookies are a given. They are ALWAYS a given. You could dump me tomorrow and you'd still get the cookies. Boston..shit, wherever dyke weddings were legalized. And where better to rub their little piggie noses in how bad they suck than right on their doorstep? What are they gonna do? Be jealous of you? Stare furiously at your tah-tahs? Not willingly give you cookies, but instead begrudgingly give you their cookies? Woman, time to wake up to the powers you wield - Uschi
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Quote:
harleykwin said:
Quote:
Grimm said:
(GA here means Green Arrow for you smartarses. )
I KNEW IT!
Ha!
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Quote:
Chewy Walrus said:
I agree. In fact, I think that's why I'd like to see Dick as Batman - just to see how he'd play it. Batman actually went to lengths to ensure that Dick wouldn't become like him - acting as a father figure, etc. - so it's impossible that Dick be exactly like Bruce. Honestly, I just think it'd be interesting to see...
You haven't read All Star Batman & Robin yet, have you?
Quote:
Chewy Walrus said:
To be honest, I prefer the younger versions of those characters to the newer ones. Wally, Kyle, and Connor were always more interesting to me than Barry, Hal, and Ollie.
The only time I read GL was when Kyle had the ring - never had any interest in Hal. Don't read Flash or Green Arrow (that's GA to you folks!), so I can't say if they are/were ever interesting or not...
Dear, sweet Harley Kwink...I'm madly in love with you. Marry me! We can go to Canadia. Or Boston or something. It'll be grand...You know the cookies are a given. They are ALWAYS a given. You could dump me tomorrow and you'd still get the cookies. Boston..shit, wherever dyke weddings were legalized. And where better to rub their little piggie noses in how bad they suck than right on their doorstep? What are they gonna do? Be jealous of you? Stare furiously at your tah-tahs? Not willingly give you cookies, but instead begrudgingly give you their cookies? Woman, time to wake up to the powers you wield - Uschi
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Ollie's cool. As for Flash and GL, give me Wally and Kyle!
Knutreturns said: Spoken like the true Greatest RDCW Champ!
All hail King Snarf!
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Quote:
Grimm said:
which character? which Bruce Wayne? which Batman? in sixty plus years of constant publication the character's always changed. yes, it works.
This isn't true. The very first Batman incarnation well resembles the current one. You can't use the sway of the times on comicbook characters to try and argue the evolution of a character. Because, in the end, that's not true evolution (the campy Batman during the Wertham era being the best example). At this point, the character of Batman has been optimized--I will admit that in the case of the current Batman being very dark is due to the audience. However, in Batman's instance, it fits.
Quote:
but if you're going to evolve the characters over a period of time as DC has half assed done since the Crisis, then eventually he's going to have to stop and go away.
And then come back, then go away, then come back again?
No. I don't want that. I'd rather he stay and writers continue to find new angles to look at him and new situations to put his particular character in.
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The Green Arrow Batman was never this dark...
Thing is- I can’t spell or type. I spell so badly my spell check doesn’t even know what I was trying to spell. And I have five Eisners HAHAHAHHA!!
-Brian Michael Bendis
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Quote:
This isn't true.
Pariah, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Go back to masturbating over your tranny hentai and your brad pitt movies. the adults are talking.
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that was a little harsh Grimm. take some of me and then rethink your response.
You could really use some of me right now.
Is it that time of the month already?
Did somebody say PMS?
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PJ, this is your lamest alt ever. 
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it ain't me...... I kind of like it though! I haven't been able to make a new alt in months.
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Quote:
Grimm said:
Pariah, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Go back to masturbating over your tranny hentai and your brad pitt movies. the adults are talking.
I hate to break it to you, but in large part I agree with Pariah.
Even the first episode of the Adam West Batman series acknolwedged that Bruce Wayne became Batman because his parents were murdered by criminals.
When the character has acted "out of character" over the years it had little, if anything, to do with an intentional evolution of the charecter's viewpoint and much more to do with a writer or editor not "getting" the original viewpoint.
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I hate to break it to you, but like Pariah, you've completely missed what I said. the half assed evolution I'm referring to has been what's happened since 1985, which I mentioned in my previous post. not that people around here can actually be bothered to read what people are saying. 
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If you were referring only to "what's happened since 1985," why did you reference "sixty plus years of constant publication"?
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Quote:
Stupid Doog said:
I don't feel like searching the thread for this answer: what does GA stand for?
gay asshole!
-----once over and twice twisted---------
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*sigh* because the sixty years of publication and the last twenty years of half assed evolution are two different points referring to two different things.
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I'm just curious how DC feels tha Batman needs to be a pompous douchebag. To me, the 70's/early 80's Batman was the best. Driven, serious, but not so gosh darn rude!
Knutreturns said: Spoken like the true Greatest RDCW Champ!
All hail King Snarf!
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Yeah, the Adams/O'Neal era was pretty key.
Dear, sweet Harley Kwink...I'm madly in love with you. Marry me! We can go to Canadia. Or Boston or something. It'll be grand...You know the cookies are a given. They are ALWAYS a given. You could dump me tomorrow and you'd still get the cookies. Boston..shit, wherever dyke weddings were legalized. And where better to rub their little piggie noses in how bad they suck than right on their doorstep? What are they gonna do? Be jealous of you? Stare furiously at your tah-tahs? Not willingly give you cookies, but instead begrudgingly give you their cookies? Woman, time to wake up to the powers you wield - Uschi
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I predict the remergence of the Silver Age!
-----once over and twice twisted---------
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Quote:
King Snarf said:
I'm just curious how DC feels tha Batman needs to be a pompous douchebag. To me, the 70's/early 80's Batman was the best. Driven, serious, but not so gosh darn rude!
yeah, even the Frank Miller "Dark Knight/Year One" Batman wasn't as pompus as the one DC gives us on a monthly basis now.
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Put the fucking lotion in the basket!
Has anyone seen Precious?
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Let's see Dc has killed about 7 characters in IC so far (not counting the mini series before it). They will probably replace them with new legacy characters...which means we will still have 2,576 legacy or original characters running around the DCU. I assume the world is not big enough for that many characters. So, many more people will die or we will get another earth or reality..atleast one. Do we really need plastic man and elongated man, do we need captain marvel and 2 supermen? the DCU is polluted with way too many redundant characters. Hopefully IC does something about this.
I think there are only 2 rules at DC..you can't kill bruce wayne, and you can't kill clark kent..there is no rule that says they can't be replaced for a while...just not permanently. I'm thinking anything can happen, but I'm betting 100% that there will be no dramatic,permanent changes in the superman or batman mythoses...that means perry, lois, alfred, jimmy, etc....that's all people outside of comics know...that said I'm betting dick grayson replaces bruce for a bit as batman.
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Quote:
Pig Iron said:
I think there are only 2 rules at DC..you can't kill bruce wayne, and you can't kill clark kent..there is no rule that says they can't be replaced for a while...just not permanently. I'm thinking anything can happen, but I'm betting 100% that there will be no dramatic,permanent changes in the superman or batman mythoses...that means perry, lois, alfred, jimmy, etc....that's all people outside of comics know...that said I'm betting dick grayson replaces bruce for a bit as batman.
I agree that they will never permanently replace Bruce and Clark, but honestly, they already already did the type of stories that you mentioned 10 years ago - Knightfall, Death of Superman - why rehash it again?
Dear, sweet Harley Kwink...I'm madly in love with you. Marry me! We can go to Canadia. Or Boston or something. It'll be grand...You know the cookies are a given. They are ALWAYS a given. You could dump me tomorrow and you'd still get the cookies. Boston..shit, wherever dyke weddings were legalized. And where better to rub their little piggie noses in how bad they suck than right on their doorstep? What are they gonna do? Be jealous of you? Stare furiously at your tah-tahs? Not willingly give you cookies, but instead begrudgingly give you their cookies? Woman, time to wake up to the powers you wield - Uschi
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Quote:
Pig Iron said:
Let's see Dc has killed about 7 characters in IC so far (not counting the mini series before it). They will probably replace them with new legacy characters...which means we will still have 2,576 legacy or original characters running around the DCU. I assume the world is not big enough for that many characters. So, many more people will die or we will get another earth or reality..atleast one. Do we really need plastic man and elongated man, do we need captain marvel and 2 supermen? the DCU is polluted with way too many redundant characters. Hopefully IC does something about this.
I think there are only 2 rules at DC..you can't kill bruce wayne, and you can't kill clark kent..there is no rule that says they can't be replaced for a while...just not permanently. I'm thinking anything can happen, but I'm betting 100% that there will be no dramatic,permanent changes in the superman or batman mythoses...that means perry, lois, alfred, jimmy, etc....that's all people outside of comics know...that said I'm betting dick grayson replaces bruce for a bit as batman.
you should be a mod
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Quote:
Pig Iron said:
I think there are only 2 rules at DC..you can't kill bruce wayne, and you can't kill clark kent..there is no rule that says they can't be replaced for a while...just not permanently. I'm thinking anything can happen, but I'm betting 100% that there will be no dramatic,permanent changes in the superman or batman mythoses...that means perry, lois, alfred, jimmy, etc....that's all people outside of comics know...that said I'm betting dick grayson replaces bruce for a bit as batman.
Quote:
harleykwin said:
I agree that they will never permanently replace Bruce and Clark, but honestly, they already already did the type of stories that you mentioned 10 years ago - Knightfall, Death of Superman - why rehash it again?
I agree with Harley. It's old hat. And they also did it with Wonder Woman...twice.
They even had Dick replace Bruce for a few months post-Knightfall. So that's old hat too.
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Quote:
Pig Iron said:
Let's see Dc has killed about 7 characters in IC so far (not counting the mini series before it).
I count six. Did Damage actually die... or just crash into the thing that blew up?
SPOILERS!
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Quote:
the G-man said:
Quote:
Pig Iron said:
I think there are only 2 rules at DC..you can't kill bruce wayne, and you can't kill clark kent..there is no rule that says they can't be replaced for a while...just not permanently. I'm thinking anything can happen, but I'm betting 100% that there will be no dramatic,permanent changes in the superman or batman mythoses...that means perry, lois, alfred, jimmy, etc....that's all people outside of comics know...that said I'm betting dick grayson replaces bruce for a bit as batman.
Quote:
harleykwin said:
I agree that they will never permanently replace Bruce and Clark, but honestly, they already already did the type of stories that you mentioned 10 years ago - Knightfall, Death of Superman - why rehash it again?
I agree with Harley. It's old hat. And they also did it with Wonder Woman...twice.
Twice? I remember Artemis, but who was WW the second time?
Quote:
They even had Dick replace Bruce for a few months post-Knightfall. So that's old hat too.
Prodigal
Dear, sweet Harley Kwink...I'm madly in love with you. Marry me! We can go to Canadia. Or Boston or something. It'll be grand...You know the cookies are a given. They are ALWAYS a given. You could dump me tomorrow and you'd still get the cookies. Boston..shit, wherever dyke weddings were legalized. And where better to rub their little piggie noses in how bad they suck than right on their doorstep? What are they gonna do? Be jealous of you? Stare furiously at your tah-tahs? Not willingly give you cookies, but instead begrudgingly give you their cookies? Woman, time to wake up to the powers you wield - Uschi
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it's never stopped them from rehashing anything before. . .
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How 'bout trying something fresh and new? That should be reason enough to stop them ...
Dear, sweet Harley Kwink...I'm madly in love with you. Marry me! We can go to Canadia. Or Boston or something. It'll be grand...You know the cookies are a given. They are ALWAYS a given. You could dump me tomorrow and you'd still get the cookies. Boston..shit, wherever dyke weddings were legalized. And where better to rub their little piggie noses in how bad they suck than right on their doorstep? What are they gonna do? Be jealous of you? Stare furiously at your tah-tahs? Not willingly give you cookies, but instead begrudgingly give you their cookies? Woman, time to wake up to the powers you wield - Uschi
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I could make a lovely suit out of Joe Quesada.
Has anyone seen Precious?
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It should. but they seem content not to. Hal Jordan? Ollie Queen? recidivism is rampant at DC and Marvel.
i'm hoping all this Crisis business will actually open the door for some change. newness. growth.
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Quote:
Buffalo Bill said:
I could make a lovely suit out of Joe Quesada.
I think you want the "No More Mutants" thread.
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Quote:
Grimm said:
It should. but they seem content not to. Hal Jordan? Ollie Queen? recidivism is rampant at DC and Marvel.
I understand the idea of keeping certain things status quo, but with characters like GL and GA (Green Arrow, not Golden Age sweetie  ) and the like, replacing them with Kyle and Connor were great moves and certainly shook things up - and unlike Azbats/Artemis or the 4 Supermen they lasted quite a bit.
I don't understand both DC and Marvel's prevalence for resurrecting dead characters either...it takes away the significance of the death in the first place. Same shit over and over again...
Quote:
i'm hoping all this Crisis business will actually open the door for some change. newness. growth.
We can dream...
Dear, sweet Harley Kwink...I'm madly in love with you. Marry me! We can go to Canadia. Or Boston or something. It'll be grand...You know the cookies are a given. They are ALWAYS a given. You could dump me tomorrow and you'd still get the cookies. Boston..shit, wherever dyke weddings were legalized. And where better to rub their little piggie noses in how bad they suck than right on their doorstep? What are they gonna do? Be jealous of you? Stare furiously at your tah-tahs? Not willingly give you cookies, but instead begrudgingly give you their cookies? Woman, time to wake up to the powers you wield - Uschi
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Quote:
Chewy Walrus said:
Quote:
Pig Iron said:
Let's see Dc has killed about 7 characters in IC so far (not counting the mini series before it).
I count six. Did Damage actually die... or just crash into the thing that blew up?
SPOILERS!
Phantom Lady
Human Bomb
Black Condor
Rat Catcher
Dr Polaris
possibly Uncle Sam...
I said around 7..heh.
I don't think Damage is dead...
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Quote:
PJP said:
Quote:
Pig Iron said:
Let's see Dc has killed about 7 characters in IC so far (not counting the mini series before it). They will probably replace them with new legacy characters...which means we will still have 2,576 legacy or original characters running around the DCU. I assume the world is not big enough for that many characters. So, many more people will die or we will get another earth or reality..atleast one. Do we really need plastic man and elongated man, do we need captain marvel and 2 supermen? the DCU is polluted with way too many redundant characters. Hopefully IC does something about this.
I think there are only 2 rules at DC..you can't kill bruce wayne, and you can't kill clark kent..there is no rule that says they can't be replaced for a while...just not permanently. I'm thinking anything can happen, but I'm betting 100% that there will be no dramatic,permanent changes in the superman or batman mythoses...that means perry, lois, alfred, jimmy, etc....that's all people outside of comics know...that said I'm betting dick grayson replaces bruce for a bit as batman.
you should be a mod
I used to be until Rob-El stripped me of my super powers.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
I agree with Harley. It's old hat. And they also did it with Wonder Woman...twice.
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harleykwin said:
Twice? I remember Artemis, but who was WW the second time?
Her mother, Hypolyta.
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Hypolyta sounds like a big fat girl.
Has anyone seen Precious?
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Quote:
Grimm said:
*sigh*
because the sixty years of publication and the last twenty years of half assed evolution are two different points referring to two different things.
Uh, okay. You didn't do a very good job of expressing that then. Both points were very conjunctive. Anywho, I disagree on both points. As G-man already pointed out, the numerous "publications" have been more or less the same, aside from some character displacement that never made sense (until around 17 years ago). And I also disagree with the idea that the evolution's been bad. And even if it was, I don't find that excuse enough to pull the character. I'd much rather retcon story--Which would be much easier, especially at this point in time.
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