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 Directed by Christopher Nolan. Hugh Jackman and Christian Bale as rival 19th century magicians. Michael Kaine and David Bowie are also in it. Just from the above I'm going to see it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Prestige_%28film%29
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 Bowie as Nikola Tesla.
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So wait. Now that he's succeeded with particular actors in one movie, he's going to re-use them over and over again?
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Yeah just like almost every other director.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
So wait. Now that he's succeeded with particular actors in one movie, he's going to re-use them over and over again?
what's wrong with that? he did a job, liked the people who worked with him, wanted to have them work on more projects with him to help ensure a pleasant work experience.
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Quote:
Ultimate Jaburg53 said:
Yeah just like almost every other director.
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Quote:
Ultimate Jaburg53 said:
Yeah just like almost every other director.
Not exactly.
Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
what's wrong with that? he did a job, liked the people who worked with him, wanted to have them work on more projects with him to help ensure a pleasant work experience.
I find it lacking originality.
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Yah when creators work with past collaborators its totally fucking unoriginal. Using Tim Roth in Pulp Fiction after Reservoir Dogs was SOOOO goddamn lame. It made me hate movies for life! Like the Rolling Stones went back and used the same guitarist for like 4 straight albums. What an unoriginal FUCKFACE! ! ! Why would you ever want to work with people you actually like???
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I think you were expecting me to like Pulp Fiction, but the thing is I don't.
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It's worked well with Depp and Tim Burton. They've churned out a series of classics.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
I think you were expecting me to like Pulp Fiction, but the thing is I don't.
as pariah's love of cock YET AGAIN presents itself....
big_pimp_tim-made it cool to roll in the first damn place! Mon Jun 11 2007 09:27 PM- harley finally rolled with me "I'm working with him...he's young but, there is much potential. He can apprentice with me and then he's yours for final training. He will remember the face of his father... Some day, Knutreturns just may be the greatest of us all...."-THE bastard
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You're apparently dyslexic. I just said that I refuse to sink to your level and suck Tarantino's cock.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
I think you were expecting me to like Pulp Fiction, but the thing is I don't.
What's funny is that everyone, including myself, was expecting you to say verbatim what you just said.
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That I refuse to sink to your level and suck Tarantino's cock?
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How so very. . . original.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
So wait. Now that he's succeeded with particular actors in one movie, he's going to re-use them over and over again?
Next you'll be criticizing directors you dislike for the type of font they use in the credits.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
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That's another thing!
Arial credits are getting really old. Directors should make sure a variety of fonts are used to credit people.
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Seriously, though: how many moderately prolific, critically acclaimed directors can you name that haven't reused the same people?
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Probably not very many. Doesn't mean I'm about to agree with them though.
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Considering that you hate 90% of all movies and 90% of directors reuse their actors it kinda all makes more sense now. You don't hate movies because directors reuse actors due their lack of originality. . . You hate them because people like them and you would hate to actually think like the people you think you unnecessarily loathe.
But you probably already knew what I was expecting.
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....Are....Are you serious?
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Probably not very many.
I assume you realize how this contradicts your "not exactly" reply to Jaburg.
Quote:
Doesn't mean I'm about to agree with them though.
Ok...but I'm willing to bet most(if not all) of the directors you like have reused actors. So, why the double-standard?
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
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By the way, the Prestige is a very good book. Christopher Priest.
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I expected nothing less from the author of classic runs in Black Panther and Steel.
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Quote:
Animalman said:
I assume you realize how this contradicts your "not exactly" reply to Jaburg.
Quote:
Animalman said:Seriously, though: how many moderately prolific, critically acclaimed directors can you name that haven't reused the same people?
You and I have different opinions on what directors make this qualification.
Plus, when you brought up re-use, I'm thinking more in the context of consistent whoring rather than isolated incidents.
Quote:
Ok...but I'm willing to bet most(if not all) of the directors you like have reused actors. So, why the double-standard?
There's a difference between "reuse" and "constant reuse." Smith, Tarantino, and Wes Anderson are guilty of the latter and Nolan seems to be on his way to following in their footsteps. In the case of the former, a director like David Fincher comes to mind who's inconsecutively used Brad Pitt in two of his movies.
Unlike Fincher, whom I find repeats the use of a certain actor only when it suits the skills of said actor, every other director on my list just milks the star/cult power of the particular people they reuse.
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I saw the trailer today...I want to see this.
"You're either lying or stupid."
"I'm stupid! I'm stupid!"
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Quote:
Pariah said:
You and I have different opinions on what directors make this qualification.
Please elaborate. I only established that qualification as I thought it was the best to cover the majority of well-known directors out there(so that you wouldn't cite some obscure director I've never heard of, or someone who didn't make enough movies to have the chance to reuse cast members).
Quote:
Plus, when you brought up re-use, I'm thinking more in the context of consistent whoring rather than isolated incidents.
So...you're predicting the future? This is Nolan's only example of reusing actors so far. Hardly what I'd call "whoring".
Quote:
There's a difference between "reuse" and "constant reuse." Smith, Tarantino, and Wes Anderson are guilty of the latter and Nolan seems to be on his way to following in their footsteps.
Unlike Fincher, whom I find repeats the use of a certain actor only when it suits the skills of said actor, every other director on my list just milks the star/cult power of the particular people they reuse.
And now you read minds!
Seriously, though, while there are certain directors for whom I wouldn't argue this holds true, it seems a bit cynical to assume this kind of thinking amongst the majority.
Wes Anderson and Kevin Smith certainly don't use the same actors just to "milk their star power". They make movies with their friends(and clearly, they benefit from having friends that are popular). Affleck, Damon and the Wilson Brothers were doing movies with Smith and Anderson long before they were stars, and they'd still be doing movies with them today even if they hadn't ever ascended to that level.
Now, there are numerous examples of Smith's publicity whoring. Even he admits that(proudly). I don't think this is one such, example, though.
I think Nolan and Fincher have a lot in common incidentally. They're selective about the projects they undertake, stylistically they use a lot of the same camera shots, and...well, they both make good flicks. I also think Brad Pitt and Christian Bale are both extraordinary actors, with the range necessary to play a variety of roles(and I thought, based on past comments you've made regarding Bale, that you felt similarly), so one can hardly fault a director that would choose to cast them regularly, which, in this case, means a whopping two times.
MisterJLA is RACKing awesome.
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Quote:
Animalman said:
Please elaborate. I only established that qualification as I thought it was the best to cover the majority of well-known directors out there(so that you wouldn't cite some obscure director I've never heard of, or someone who didn't make enough movies to have the chance to reuse cast members).
When you said "critically acclaimed," I actually assumed that you meant directors that I personally like. I s'pose I was confused because you're not the type to like something just cuz' the Academy said so.
Quote:
So...you're predicting the future? This is Nolan's only example of reusing actors so far. Hardly what I'd call "whoring".
Actually, with the third Batman movie on the way, it'll be the third movie in a row he'll do with Bale. 
Seriously though, while I can understand he'd need Bale for a second Bat-movie, hand-picking him for two movies in a row really seems like leeching off of the actor's fame to me. He didn't actually discover Bale for Batman Begins; the fans were actually shouting for Bale before he was made the director. Even if he didn't want him, he'd still have to cast him. I honestly do not believe that he would have casted Bale for Prestige if BB did poorly. So, in any case, the "future" is now.
Quote:
Wes Anderson and Kevin Smith certainly don't use the same actors just to "milk their star power". They make movies with their friends(and clearly, they benefit from having friends that are popular). Affleck, Damon and the Wilson Brothers were doing movies with Smith and Anderson long before they were stars, and they'd still be doing movies with them today even if they hadn't ever ascended to that level.
I'll conceed that Anderson and Smith probably aren't whoring in this case, although I still have my doubts. When I think of actors being reused for Anderson, I'm thinking more of Bill Murray than the Wilson Brothers (but I did include them). Him, along with just about all of Smith's regular casting, are notorious cult labels. For example: Everyone knows Affleck can't act, but it's because his personality was so merged with Smith's primary fanbase that the audience could enjoy his inclusion in both J&SBSB and Dogma (not me of course). It's because he carried the esoteric Smithian charm that the movies he and Smith do together don't end up in smoke like Gili.
Murray is in the same vein as Affleck in that rite (except he can actually act), especially taking into mind that he has his own trademark deadpan personality that helps make Anderson's movies the most recognizable in terms of atmosphere (but only cuz' he's been in them multiple times).
Anyway, my point is that when I was taking those particular directors into mind, I was thinking more of their actors' prominance as cult actors than as people who could actually act. They were just the more convenient examples.
In any event, I still find the inclusion of the same actor(s) in two or more consecutive movies to be unoriginal. You're probably right that they're all friends and may not be fame-grabbing, but I don't feel that makes the construction of the movie's cast any better.
Quote:
I think Nolan and Fincher have a lot in common incidentally. They're selective about the projects they undertake, stylistically they use a lot of the same camera shots, and...well, they both make good flicks.
Fincher I will readily agree with you on, but I don't think Nolan has earned 'good director' status yet personally. Insomnia was not as good as Memento. And even so, Memento had problems as well; I liked the movie and its premise a great deal but the character didn't make sense--I mean, how the hell could he remember that he couldn't remember if he no long term memory!?
Quote:
I also think Brad Pitt and Christian Bale are both extraordinary actors, with the range necessary to play a variety of roles(and I thought, based on past comments you've made regarding Bale, that you felt similarly),
I agree, but at the same time I don't think they should belong to any one director if you get my drift. Fincher has proven himself an individual that doesn't need a consistent A list actor like Pitt to sell or make good movies. Nolan's history is....Well I think one of the problems is that he doesn't have much history. He's given us one epic movie, one good movie (I refuse to see BB, but for the sake of argument, I'll run along with the status quo here and title it as "good"), and crap. My opinion of him based on his past career would be much less tainted if it weren't for the fact that he was directing his 4th and 5th movie with the same actor from the third. The icing to all of this is that Batman is one of the most famous characters out there (well, Nolan and Goyer's Batman anyway).
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so one can hardly fault a director that would choose to cast them regularly
Eh....I admit that Pitt and Bale are both exceptionally versatile actors, but at the same time, neither of them could play a character like say the Narrator without looking silly (although, Pitt would probably refuse to starve himself for the part like Bale would). In that rite, I don't think it was imperative that Bale get the part in Prestige.
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I have yet to see how casting someone you've worked with as "unoriginal."
"Oh, God! He cast Bill Murray in a movie! Other people have cast Bill Murray in a movie! This guy is just ripping off Harold Ramis!"
I think until you've actually seen the movie and Bale's performance, you can't really make any assumptions. Especially the kind of assumptions you like to make. If Bale is totally wrong for the role and blows it, then I'd be more willing to conceed that Nolan is trying to ride Bale's popularity (though, which director in Hollywood isn't using a star's drawing power to make his own movie succeed?). Directors and actors tend to like working with people over again because once they figure each other out, they're able to work better and faster with one another. Plus, as has been mentioned, many of them become friends.
Kurt Russell likes working with John Carpenter. The Cohen brothers like working with John Turturro, John Goodman, Frances McDormand, and Steve Buscemi. That "unoriginal" casting has led to some of the most enjoyable and memorable films I've ever seen.
whomod said: I generally don't like it when people decide to play by the rules against people who don't play by the rules. It tends to put you immediately at a disadvantage and IMO is a sign of true weakness. This is true both in politics and on the internet." Our Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man said: "no, the doctor's right. besides, he has seniority."
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Quote:
Fused said:
Considering that you hate 90% of all movies and 90% of directors reuse their actors it kinda all makes more sense now. You don't hate movies because directors reuse actors due their lack of originality. . . You hate them because people like them and you would hate to actually think like the people you think you unnecessarily loathe.
But you probably already knew what I was expecting.
that just sounds so right.
big_pimp_tim-made it cool to roll in the first damn place! Mon Jun 11 2007 09:27 PM- harley finally rolled with me "I'm working with him...he's young but, there is much potential. He can apprentice with me and then he's yours for final training. He will remember the face of his father... Some day, Knutreturns just may be the greatest of us all...."-THE bastard
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Quote:
Pariah said:
When you said "critically acclaimed," I actually assumed that you meant directors that I personally like. I s'pose I was confused because you're not the type to like something just cuz' the Academy said so.
...?
Let me re-explain my position here:
You criticized Nolan for recasting actors, calling him "unoriginal" and implying that it was whorish behavior on his part. I feel that yours was a silly, petty criticism, and I went about showing it to you by asking you to name any director who didn't exhibit similar behavior. I made the qualification of a "critically acclaimed" director because, as I explained already, I didn't want you to cite some obscure director I'd never heard of. My liking them didn't matter. The Academy liking them certainly doesn't matter. You mentioned Fincher earlier. I'd consider him to be a critically acclaimed director(and one that's recasted actors). He's yet to be nominated by the Academy, for anything.
Quote:
He didn't actually discover Bale for Batman Begins; the fans were actually shouting for Bale before he was made the director. Even if he didn't want him, he'd still have to cast him. I honestly do not believe that he would have casted Bale for Prestige if BB did poorly. So, in any case, the "future" is now.
I don't think Nolan had to cast him because the fans said so. Maybe because the studio said so...
I have no idea what Nolan would have done if Batman flopped. It's an odd hypothetical, because the movie had so many great pieces. I think the fate of the movie was decided by how well Nolan and Bale work well together.
Quote:
I'll conceed that Anderson and Smith probably aren't whoring in this case, although I still have my doubts. When I think of actors being reused for Anderson, I'm thinking more of Bill Murray than the Wilson Brothers (but I did include them). Him, along with just about all of Smith's regular casting, are notorious cult labels. For example: Everyone knows Affleck can't act, but it's because his personality was so merged with Smith's primary fanbase that the audience could enjoy his inclusion in both J&SBSB and Dogma (not me of course). It's because he carried the esoteric Smithian charm that the movies he and Smith do together don't end up in smoke like Gili.
Murray is in the same vein as Affleck in that rite (except he can actually act), especially taking into mind that he has his own trademark deadpan personality that helps make Anderson's movies the most recognizable in terms of atmosphere.
I'm not a huge fan of Kevin Smith or Wes Anderson, personally. That being said, I don't know many self-respecting directors that would cast someone just to cash in their popularity. Murray and Affleck are well-known, yes, but can't that just be incidental? Smith likes Affleck(for whatever reason), and Anderson likes Murray(for very clear reasons). That their mere presence will help sell tickets is a bonus.
Quote:
In any event, I still find the inclusion of the same actor(s) in two or more consecutive movies to be unoriginal.
Why does the actor matter? Shouldn't it be the role, the story, etc?
Afterall, the job of the actor is to be somebody else. If a director uses the same actor in a same kind of role, or in a different role but the same kind of story, then I think you might have a legitimate argument. I don't know how much you know about the Prestige, but I assure you, Batman and Alfred Borden are different.
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Fincher has proven himself an individual that doesn't need a consistent A list actor like Pitt to sell or make good movies.
When hasn't he used A list actors? Why should that even matter?
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Nolan's history is....Well I think one of the problems is that he doesn't have much history. He's given us one epic movie, one good movie (I refuse to see BB, but for the sake of argument, I'll run along with the status quo here and title it as "good"), and crap.
I thought Insomnia was fine. Flawed, and definitely a bit more "Hollywood" than the original, but fine. Memento was fantastic, Following I liked a lot, and Batman was one of the best comic adaptations I've ever seen.
So, that's four Nolan movies, to Fincher's five. Personally, I liked Memento more than Fight Club or Seven, but all three are among my all-time faves. I liked both Following and Batman more than Alien 3 or Panic Room, and perhaps more than the Game, though I think that's an extremely underrated film.
The point is, neither has an extremely long list of credits. Nolan came from indy roots. Fincher worked up from music videos. Thus, Fincher has more commercial movies to his name, but the quality of Nolan's work is just as high, in my opinion.
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jessica biel is in this. This in now a must watch movie.
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
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Wrong magician movie. That's the Illusionist with Ed Norton.
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Well, anyway. Wolverine would kick Batman's ass because Batman doesn't kill.
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Quote:
Animalman said:
Wrong magician movie. That's the Illusionist with Ed Norton.
yeah
I should pay more attention.
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
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