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You gotta wonder if Iggy knopws that Muslim honor-killings are carried out in Western culture as well as the Middle East. It seems he's not actually aware of this.
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If many Christians had their way, yes. Unequivocally, yes. This isn't a what if question as to whether or not it would happen if society allowed it, but rather if you honestly believe your average Christian had the capacity to do it. Unequivocally, yes. You have a secular century scared shitless at the previous centuries of religious warfare to thank for establishing a Western World that isn't conducive to such barbaric Christian behavior. You are welcome.
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You gotta wonder if Iggy knopws that Muslim honor-killings are carried out in Western culture as well as the Middle East. It seems he's not actually aware of this. Only The Shadow Knopws!
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Unequivocally, yes.
You have a secular century scared shitless at the previous centuries of religious warfare to thank for establishing a Western World that isn't conducive to such barbaric Christian behavior. You are welcome. I think you mean "barbaric Muslim behavior" as it was their continuous expansion up the continent towards Europe that sparked the Crusades. So the French Revolution--a secularly motivated movement--was a civilized alternative to all of the incidents of violence that occurred...you know, even though it caused more death and suffering than all incidents of Inquisition violence combined. But more to point: people still believe in Christianity and practice Christian lifestyles (our culture is, after all, founded upon those values) and yet they generally haven't resorted to violence. Muslims, on the other hand--inside and outside of Western culture--resort to violence with regularity...As that is, of course, what their religion dictates. As such, your claim that a Christian would have been just as likely to commit this crime is rather unfounded--especially since whatever past acts of violence you can come up with regards to Christians were ordered by edicts of authority figures in the Catholic Church or the Protestant movements. This is opposed to individual Christians taking the decision to execute others into their own hands according to a mentality you think they have in common with Muslims.
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You gotta wonder if Iggy knopws that Muslim honor-killings are carried out in Western culture as well as the Middle East. It seems he's not actually aware of this. Only The Shadow Knopws! Haha! JLA's so desperate for material at this point that he has to go after spelling mistakes.
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I think you mean "barbaric Muslim behavior" as it was their continuous expansion up the continent towards Europe that sparked the Crusades. Wow. You've been reading a lot of revisionist literature. Arab expansion, at worst, falls into the same category as the expansion of groups (even Christian barbarians) like the Franks. You are cherry picking Arab expansion to fit your worldview. Sorry, Christians were busy killing themselves and the Sassanids at the same time. And, because of that, opened the way for Arab encroachment into Europe. Please spare me your us versus them bullshit reading of history. So the French Revolution--a secularly motivated movement--was a civilized alternative to all of the incidents of violence that occurred...you know, even though it caused more death and suffering than all incidents of Inquisition violence combined. Would like to see your stats for that. That said, the French Revolution was rationalism taken to a religious level. Bad things happen whenever things are taken religiously. Thanks for re-affirming my point. As such, your claim that a Christian would have been just as likely to commit this crime is rather unfounded--especially since whatever past acts of violence you can come up with regards to Christians were ordered by edicts of authority figures in the Catholic Church or the Protestant movements. This is opposed to individual Christians taking the decision to execute others into their own hands according to a mentality you think they have in common with Muslims. Oh, wait, I thought we established at Nuremberg that "only following orders" wasn't an excuse. Yet, now, here you are trying to weasel out of every individual Christian's picking up a sword and killing Jews, Muslims, Gypsies, or each other by claiming they were only following orders. Try again or admit you would've acquitted Goering.
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All religions and cultures are the same!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!
Sincerely,
IggyJLA Yes, I'm sure it takes a lot of courage to mock someone as opposed to, you know, address the issue.
All you're doing is running scared from it.
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7410367.stm Bush apology for Koran shooting US President George W Bush has made a personal apology over the shooting of a Koran by an American soldier, the White House has confirmed.
Mr Bush made the apology during one of his regular video conferences with Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri Maliki.
The soldier was sent home by the US military after the Muslim holy book was found riddled with bullet holes at a shooting range by Iraqi police.
The US military said last week that the soldier would be disciplined.
He was unnamed, but was said to be a staff sergeant in a sniper section.
'People's anger'
Mr Maliki's office said in a statement: "The American president apologised on behalf of the United States... promising to present the soldier to the courts."
Mr Maliki had expressed the anger felt by the Iraqi people, his office said.
A US military spokesman last week described the shooting as "both serious and deeply troubling", but stressed it was an "isolated incident and a result of one soldier's actions".
US military authorities have already apologised to community leaders in the area, west of Baghdad.
The military presented the elders with a new copy of the Koran.
The G-PariahMan LMAO!!!! 
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Why we are not carpet bombing these ungrateful subhumans back to the stone age in which they obviously want to reside is beyond me. Because this is the 21st century, might does not make right, and you're an ignorant, violent ape just like all of your Rightwing Crazies. Attack the ones responsible? Yes. Carpet-bomb innocent civilians because they're brown and don't worship your 'Gawd'? No. "Ungrateful". Yeah, how DARE those 'savages' don't appreciate the US invading and conquering their country to set up a puppet regime for more oil. How fucking old are you, man? Give me a break. Talk about over-reacting. Why do all Rightwing Extremists want to kill everyone? Why is that? I guess that's why Bush attacked Iraq, even though they had nothing to do with 9/11. Just an excuse to kill more brown people... 
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Wow. You've been reading a lot of revisionist literature. Arab expansion, at worst, falls into the same category as the expansion of groups (even Christian barbarians) like the Franks. You are cherry picking Arab expansion to fit your worldview. Sorry, Christians were busy killing themselves and the Sassanids at the same time. And, because of that, opened the way for Arab encroachment into Europe. Please spare me your us versus them bullshit reading of history. We seem to have had this discussion before: First, there is no such group as the Byzantines. Please, quite living living in a Western European dominated way of thinking. It was the eastern half of the Roman Empire. You are already showing a prejudice against historical reality. Spare me, please.
You mean the same Roman Empire that Christian Crusaders sacked in 1204?
Further, let's be clear, a large part of the call for the First Crusade was in response to the loss of Armenia and Anatolia to the Seljuk Turks afrer the Battle of Manzikert. This battle did not need to take place and only did because Romanos violated the terms of peace between them from a year prior. Also, the historical record shows that the Alp Arslan proposed a treaty that was highly favorable to the Romans prior to the battle but that it was rejected by Romanos. So, the battle took place. The Eastern Roman armies were crushed. And, the Seljuks took hold of large tracts of land in the aforementioned territories. It was in regard to the settling of these former Roman territories, which saw rather large scale Seljuk mirgration in the decades following 1071, that Alexios Komnenos called upon Urban to raise the crusader army. So all of this to grudgingly admit that the Seljuk Turks provoked the war in a "gotcha" manner that allows you to flex you amateur wiki-historian muscle. "I know history PA-RAI-AH!! *smile*" Not quite. Aside from your admission that Armenia and Anatolia was annexed without provocation from the Byzantine Empire (prior to your "yeah, but...Alps' peace treaty!"), Islamic culture had been expanding north since 636 AD. You really think it was going to stop on account of a peace treaty in the midst of a weakening empire? With time, it would just keep going. The crusades started as a product of territorial disputes that were ignited by a violently expanding Muslim Empire. You tried your damnedest to avoid mentioning the fact that it was the Muslims that began to breach European boundaries by bringing up Ramanos' refusal to adhere to a coerced peace treaty, but conveniently leave out that it was only after Arslan took Anatolia and Armenia. Who cherry picks again? Would like to see your stats for that. The official death toll for the French Revolution is over 600,000--which I don't believe takes into account for the Napoleonic Wars. A couple other books I've read put it closer to one million. Both Catholic and Protestant inquisitions combined are responsible for a fraction of that many deaths. That said, the French Revolution was rationalism taken to a religious level. Bad things happen whenever things are taken religiously. Thanks for re-affirming my point. Yeaaaaaaah--Nice try, but no dice. Religion is not self-evidently equated to violence. That's your argument. Not your itinerary. Your tune has been, 'It's religious, and therefore it's violent.' Not, 'It's violent and therefore it's religious.' The simplest explanation is often the most correct: cultural mentalities are relative according to the differing philosophies that are being endorsed by said mentalities--whether the given philosophy keeps religious connotations or not. Oh, wait, I thought we established at Nuremberg that "only following orders" wasn't an excuse. Yet, now, here you are trying to weasel out of every individual Christian's picking up a sword and killing Jews, Muslims, Gypsies, or each other by claiming they were only following orders. Try again or admit you would've acquitted Goering. I'm not excusing anyone for anything (I can easily admit that the influence of the Vatican has been misused in the past). I'm saying that killing people is not, and never has been, the product of a general mentality cultured by Christianity as an applied philosophy--which is why it's silly to assume that a Christian would have been just as likely to kill those soldiers as a Muslim.
Last edited by Pariah; 2012-02-28 5:52 AM. Reason: Some of my reply got cut off.
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All religions and cultures are the same!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!
Sincerely,
IggyJLA Yes, I'm sure it takes a lot of courage to mock someone as opposed to, you know, address the issue.
All you're doing is running scared from it. Actually I've been addressing every post directly. And then I proceeded to translate Iggy and Pro's tunes from bullshit to crystal clarity. All JLA can do is passively support with extraneous topics. Poor li'l JLA.
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All religions and cultures are the same!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!
Sincerely,
IggyJLA Yes, I'm sure it takes a lot of courage to mock someone as opposed to, you know, address the issue.
All you're doing is running scared from it.  TAAAAKE MEEEEE SERIOUSSSSLLLLYYYYYY!!!!!!!!!! 
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Because all the Muslim protesters were chucking grenades and shooting people in the back of the head, right? Sure, I'm glad Pariah won't necessarily be the one to hunt me down for burning a bible. That doesn't mean, however, that everyone else in the Christian community would be so tolerant. ... Please cite the last time any Christian in the US shot anyone or chucked a grenade at them for improperly disposing of a bible. You're right. We just have a history of killing others because they weren't the right kind of Christian. Totally different and completely justifiable. My bad. Or, you know, we just threaten them with death because they don't believe in the God of Christian America. Once again, totally different and completely justifiable. Sure you don't have a secret fetish for eating flesh and drinking blood, G?  You can't accuse two groups of moral equivalence if you can't show both groups engage in the same behavior. You've made some broad conclusory allegations which appear (the sarcasm and hyperbole make it hard to be sure) to be directed at military actions. If so, is it your position that a military action is exactly the same thing as what happened here? We're talking mob violence here. Yes, we have a history of Christian mobs killing others because they weren't the "right" type of Christian or because they weren't Christian. Religious violence is religious violence. Period. You want to give some specific examples? And then show us where as seems to be the case Afghanistan, they were govt or church sanctioned?
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STOP IT!! STOP IT!! STOP IT!! JUST GO AWAY!!!! AARRRRRGH!!! Roger.
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All religions and cultures are the same!! WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!
Sincerely,
IggyJLA Yes, I'm sure it takes a lot of courage to mock someone as opposed to, you know, address the issue.
All you're doing is running scared from it. TAAAAKE MEEEEE SERIOUSSSSLLLLYYYYYY!!!!!!!!!!
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Why we are not carpet bombing these ungrateful subhumans back to the stone age in which they obviously want to reside is beyond me. Because this is the 21st century, might does not make right, and you're an ignorant, violent ape just like all of your Rightwing Crazies. Attack the ones responsible? Yes. Carpet-bomb innocent civilians because they're brown and don't worship your 'Gawd'? No. "Ungrateful". Yeah, how DARE those 'savages' don't appreciate the US invading and conquering their country to set up a puppet regime for more oil. How fucking old are you, man? Give me a break. Talk about over-reacting. Why do all Rightwing Extremists want to kill everyone? Why is that? I guess that's why Bush attacked Iraq, even though they had nothing to do with 9/11. Just an excuse to kill more brown people...
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"Batman is only meaningful as an answer to a world which in its basics is chaotic and in the hands of the wrong people, where no justice can be found. I think it's very suitable to our perception of the world's condition today... Batman embodies the will to resist evil" -Frank Miller
"Conan, what's the meaning of life?"
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women!"
-Conan the Barbarian
"Well, yeah."
-Jason E. Perkins
"If I had a dime for every time Pariah was right about something I'd owe twenty cents."
-Ultimate Jaburg53
"Fair enough. I defer to your expertise."
-Prometheus
Rack MisterJLA!
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I did a word search for "Shariah." Came up nil. Didn't read it.
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The crusades started as a product of territorial disputes that were ignited by a violently expanding Muslim Empire. You tried your damnedest to avoid mentioning the fact that it was the Muslims that began to breach European boundaries by bringing up Ramanos' refusal to adhere to a coerced peace treaty, but conveniently leave out that it was only after Arslan took Anatolia and Armenia.
Who cherry picks again? Once again, you lie about the historical record to suit your story. Arslan didn't want war and, at the time in the very least, did not want Anatolia. Your "coerced" treaty was based upon an Eastern Roman offensive that turned into a debacle with the capture of Manuel. Arslan could've asked for whatever he wanted. Instead, he gave them quite favorable terms because he didn't want to fight them. He had bigger fish to fry (see, Egyptian Fatimid Caliphate). This treaty was violated when the Eastern Romans retook Heiropolis. In return, Arslan laid siege to Edessa. Now, here we are, back in 1071. The Eastern Romans marched on the Turks to relieve Edessa. Arslan could have fought them. He didn't. He agreed to a new treaty that was, once again, favorable to Roman interests in that he ceded Heiropolis and ended his siege of Edessa. Why? BECAUSE HE WANTED TO FIGHT THE FATIMIDS! Arslan now moves south against the Caliphate. The Romans then abandon the treaty and invade. Arslan is forced to turn his army around to fight them. Battle of Manzikert happens. Roman Emperor is captured. Held a week. Still, given favorable terms that left the Anatolian heartland solidly Roman. Released. His Christian Roman, Doukas, leads a revolt against him that ends with Romanos being so blinded in such an horrific way that he dies of an infection to the face! Doukas revolt sets off a series of revolts in the Anatolian plain. All across the plain, claimants to the throne cede land for Turkish recognition. Unable to defend their claims, they call upon Seljuk mercenaries to defend their cities. Meanwhile, good ole Christian Normans are rampaging in Anatolia under Bailleul. So bad was the organization of the Empire at the time that the called in...want to take a guess...THE TURKS to drive him out. Concessions for that and territorial gains made during the chaotic Roman civil wars and the various Roman factions ceding territory for recognition lead to the establishment of the Sultanate of Rum by the Turks in Anatolia. But, once again, I would like to know why you are so troubled by various Muslim groups gaining from a millennium long process of Roman collapse as compared to gains made by Franks, Vandals, Ostrogoths, Visigoths, Huns, Avars, Bulgarians, Normans, Sassanids, The Kiev Rus, the Serbs, internal rebellions (e.g. Trebizond) etc. etc. etc...? The official death toll for the French Revolution is over 600,000--which I don't believe takes into account for the Napoleonic Wars. A couple other books I've read put it closer to one million.
Both Catholic and Protestant inquisitions combined are responsible for a fraction of that many deaths. Those figures inlcude the French Revolutionary Wars that were fought between France and a whole bunch of scared monarchs. If those are included, then it is only fair to include the death tolls of the various religious wars into the equation. Do you really want to do that? Yeaaaaaaah--Nice try, but no dice.
Religion is not self-evidently equated to violence. That's your argument. Not your itinerary.
Your tune has been, 'It's religious, and therefore it's violent.' Not, 'It's violent and therefore it's religious.'
The simplest explanation is often the most correct: cultural mentalities are relative according to the differing philosophies that are being endorsed by said mentalities--whether the given philosophy keeps religious connotations or not. Actually, I'm right. The Revolution did take a spiritual turn with the establishment of such religious groups as the Cult of Reason and Robespierre's Cult of the Supreme Being. Sorry. You're wrong again. I'm not excusing anyone for anything (I can easily admit that the influence of the Vatican has been misused in the past). I'm saying that killing people is not, and never has been, the product of a general mentality cultured by Christianity as an applied philosophy--which is why it's silly to assume that a Christian would have been just as likely to kill those soldiers as a Muslim. Yet, again, here you are trying to point to Vatican influence as the determining factor in free Christian agents deciding to throw Jews into a synagogue and set it on fire.
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You want to give some specific examples? And then show us where as seems to be the case Afghanistan, they were govt or church sanctioned? Here's a big one for you: The second iteration of the Ku Klux Klan. Sanctioned and allowed to hold membership drives in protestant churches nationwide. Unlike the original Klan of the Reconstruction South, this one focused mainly on ant-Catholic and Jewish sentiments and reached estimated membership of six million with some of the most powerful Klan branches being in "Redneck Southern Backwaters" like Indiana. I know we like to focus on the racial when regarding the Klan, but any full study of this second group necessitates a focus on the overtly religious Protestantism of the organization. Period.
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The day forever fortunate has arrived, which the French people have consecrated to the Supreme Being. Never has the world which He created offered to Him a spectacle so worthy of His notice. He has seen reigning on the earth tyranny, crime, and imposture. He sees at this moment a whole nation, grappling with all the oppressions of the human race, suspend the course of its heroic labors to elevate its thoughts and vows toward the great Being who has given it the mission it has undertaken and the strength to accomplish it.
Is it not He whose immortal hand, engraving on the heart of man the code of justice and equality, has written there the death sentence of tyrants? Is it not He who, from the beginning of time, decreed for all the ages and for all peoples liberty, good faith, and justice?
He did not create kings to devour the human race. He did not create priests to harness us, like vile animals, to the chariots of kings and to give to the world examples of baseness, pride, perfidy, avarice, debauchery, and falsehood. He created the universe to proclaim His power. He created men to help each other, to love each other mutually, and to attain to happiness by the way of virtue.
It is He who implanted in the breast of the triumphant oppressor remorse and terror, and in the heart of the oppressed and innocent calmness and fortitude. It is He who impels the just man to hate the evil one, and the evil man to respect the just one. It is He who adorns with modesty the brow of beauty, to make it yet more beautiful. It is He who makes the mother's heart beat with tenderness and joy. It is He who bathes with delicious tears the eyes of the son pressed to the bosom of his mother. It is He who silences the most imperious and tender passions before the sublime love of the fatherland. It is He who has covered nature with charms, riches, and majesty. All that is good is His work, or is Himself. Evil belongs to the depraved man who oppresses his fellow man or suffers him to be oppressed.
The Author of Nature has bound all mortals by a boundless chain of love and happiness. Perish the tyrants who have dared to break it!
Republican Frenchmen, it is yours to purify the earth which they have soiled, and to recall to it the justice that they have banished! Liberty and virtue together came from the breast of Divinity. Neither can abide with mankind without the other.
O generous People, would you triumph over all your enemies? Practice justice, and render the Divinity the only worship worthy of Him. O People, let us deliver ourselves today, under His auspices, to the just transports of a pure festivity. Tomorrow we shall return to the combat with vice and tyrants. We shall give to the world the example of republican virtues. And that will be to honor Him still.
The monster which the genius of kings had vomited over France has gone back into nothingness. May all the crimes and all the misfortunes of the world disappear with it! Armed in turn with the daggers of fanaticism and the poisons of atheism, kings have always conspired to assassinate humanity. If they are able no longer to disfigure Divinity by superstition, to associate it with their crimes, they try to banish it from the earth, so that they may reign there alone with crime.
O People, fear no more their sacrilegious plots! They can no more snatch the world from the breast of its Author than remorse from their own hearts. Unfortunate ones, uplift your eyes toward heaven! Heroes of the fatherland, your generous devotion is not a brilliant madness. If the satellites of tyranny can assassinate you, it is not in their power entirely to destroy you. Man, whoever thou mayest be, thou canst still conceive high thoughts for thyself. Thou canst bind thy fleeting life to God, and to immortality. Let nature seize again all her splendor, and wisdom all her empire! The Supreme Being has not been annihilated.
It is wisdom above all that our guilty enemies would drive from the republic. To wisdom alone it is given to strengthen the prosperity of empires. It is for her to guarantee to us the rewards of our courage. Let us associate wisdom, then, with all our enterprises. Let us be grave and discreet in all our deliberations, as men who are providing for the interests of the world. Let us be ardent and obstinate in our anger against conspiring tyrants, imperturbable in dangers, patient in labors, terrible in striking back, modest and vigilant in successes. Let us be generous toward the good, compassionate with the unfortunate, inexorable with the evil, just toward every one. Let us not count on an unmixed prosperity, and on triumphs without attacks, nor on all that depends on fortune or the perversity of others. Sole, but infallible guarantors of our independence, let us crush the impious league of kings by the grandeur of our character, even more than by the strength of our arms.
Frenchmen, you war against kings; you are therefore worthy to honor Divinity. Being of Beings, Author of Nature, the brutalized slave, the vile instrument of despotism, the perfidious and cruel aristocrat, outrages Thee by his very invocation of Thy name. But the defenders of liberty can give themselves up to Thee, and rest with confidence upon Thy paternal bosom. Being of Beings, we need not offer to Thee unjust prayers. Thou knowest Thy creatures, proceeding from Thy hands. Their needs do not escape Thy notice, more than their secret thoughts. Hatred of bad faith and tyranny burns in our hearts, with love of justice and the fatherland. Our blood flows for the cause of humanity. Behold our prayer. Behold our sacrifices. Behold the worship we offer Thee. #PariahIsAnIdiot
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The correlation between institution of civic religion(s) and the rise of the Reign of Terror is completely coincidental. #PariahIsAnIdiot
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The fool has said in his heart, "There is no God." Atheism is aristocratic... #PariahIsAnIdiot
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Summarize please. Unless it actually makes a point about how Robespierre's esoteric new form of Deism was highly influential and culturally pervasive in the French mindsets--as opposed to just being a quote filled with its doctrine--I'm not gonna bother reading it. Once again, you lie about the historical record to suit your story. Arslan didn't want war and, at the time in the very least, did not want Anatolia.
Your "coerced" treaty was based upon an Eastern Roman offensive that turned into a debacle with the capture of Manuel. Arslan could've asked for whatever he wanted. Instead, he gave them quite favorable terms I stopped right there as it was apparent that you were going to continue rationalizing the fact that they invaded without provocation. You have a very odd penchant for redirection when you're backed into a corner. It's as if you actually think you're convincing because you offer a background story to the fact that they did these things, but it doesn't really explain it away. It just obfuscates. Those figures inlcude the French Revolutionary Wars that were fought between France and a whole bunch of scared monarchs. If those are included, then it is only fair to include the death tolls of the various religious wars into the equation. Do you really want to do that? The Crusades were not religious wars. Everyone likes to label them as such since the soldiers felt they were protecting the main Christian continent. More aptly however, the conflicts were territory disputes; the Seljuk Turks moved in, and then other nations responded. You can argue that many individual soldiers fought with their faith in mind--as that was the key recruitment factor--but you can't argue that-that's why the wars were fought by the European governments. If that were the case, why didn't Europe just begin its own invasion of the Muslim territories prior to the incidents? Actually, I'm right. The Revolution did take a spiritual turn with the establishment of such religious groups as the Cult of Reason and Robespierre's Cult of the Supreme Being. Sorry. You're wrong again. The Cult of Reason referred back to the French people as arbiters of the philosophy. i.e. The mob was a higher power unto itself. This is antithetical to faith-based philosophies. And Robespierre's Supreme Being doctrine was enforced from a political standpoint. It wasn't a virally influential movement that the entire era was centered around; more like a symptom of a larger movement. Even if I were to entertain the idea that the mobs of France turned religious, it wasn't a cult or spiritual philosophy that motivated the mobs to start slaughtering and raping the upper class, raid public establishments--slaughtering some more people in the process--and execute the royal family. And it sure as hell wasn't religion that motivated Napoleon. It seems what you're trying to do is conflate a "religious" label to whatever extreme doctrine or philosophy that might happen to surface, but you're not applying very stringent parameters to actually define it adequately--which make sense because keeping your use of the term more abstract allows you to make more nebulous claims. Yet, again, here you are trying to point to Vatican influence as the determining factor in free Christian agents deciding to throw Jews into a synagogue and set it on fire. Uh, no. I don't believe the Vatican ever authorized that. But are you claiming that this is, and was, a common occurrence among individual Christians? Have we seen a great deal of Christian burnings of Synagogues with people inside them over the years? Here's a big one for you: The second iteration of the Ku Klux Klan. Sanctioned and allowed to hold membership drives in protestant churches nationwide.
Unlike the original Klan of the Reconstruction South, this one focused mainly on ant-Catholic and Jewish sentiments and reached estimated membership of six million with some of the most powerful Klan branches being in "Redneck Southern Backwaters" like Indiana.
I know we like to focus on the racial when regarding the Klan, but any full study of this second group necessitates a focus on the overtly religious Protestantism of the organization. Period. Just to be clear: are you saying it was a Protestant movement or that it was a movement with Protestants in it? Because the initial formation of the Klan and the second--as you say--was racially motivated. The question you have to ask here is: if race wasn't an issue, would they really have bothered doing the recruitment in the first place? In which case, it seems more like the Klan artificially conjoined the two principles all on their own. As much as I used to rag on Protestants for the Klan, I can't really say they were at fault for its conception.
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Joined: May 2003
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Officially "too old for this shit" 15000+ posts
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You want to give some specific examples? And then show us where as seems to be the case Afghanistan, they were govt or church sanctioned? Here's a big one for you: The second iteration of the Ku Klux Klan. Sanctioned and allowed to hold membership drives in protestant churches nationwide. Unlike the original Klan of the Reconstruction South, this one focused mainly on ant-Catholic and Jewish sentiments and reached estimated membership of six million ... So, the best example you could come up with a group that reached its zenith nearly a century ago and whose membership had bottom out approximately ten years before WWII...largely in response to revulsion over the group's violent tactics? (The above link being from the Anti-Defamation League, who ought to know a thing or two about religious persecution, btw).
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Joined: Dec 2004
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Unbreakable 3000+ posts
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"Batman is only meaningful as an answer to a world which in its basics is chaotic and in the hands of the wrong people, where no justice can be found. I think it's very suitable to our perception of the world's condition today... Batman embodies the will to resist evil" -Frank Miller
"Conan, what's the meaning of life?"
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women!"
-Conan the Barbarian
"Well, yeah."
-Jason E. Perkins
"If I had a dime for every time Pariah was right about something I'd owe twenty cents."
-Ultimate Jaburg53
"Fair enough. I defer to your expertise."
-Prometheus
Rack MisterJLA!
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The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
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The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
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Have you even read the discussion thus far?
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Joined: Jun 2004
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Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
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Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
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To be fair he did just discover wikipedia.
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
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Joined: Dec 2004
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Unbreakable 3000+ posts
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Unbreakable 3000+ posts
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Stop picking on the extremists of my religion! They're so much better than the extremists of other religions!
"Batman is only meaningful as an answer to a world which in its basics is chaotic and in the hands of the wrong people, where no justice can be found. I think it's very suitable to our perception of the world's condition today... Batman embodies the will to resist evil" -Frank Miller
"Conan, what's the meaning of life?"
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women!"
-Conan the Barbarian
"Well, yeah."
-Jason E. Perkins
"If I had a dime for every time Pariah was right about something I'd owe twenty cents."
-Ultimate Jaburg53
"Fair enough. I defer to your expertise."
-Prometheus
Rack MisterJLA!
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,153
Unbreakable 3000+ posts
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Unbreakable 3000+ posts
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Don't worry Pariah, I'll save you! Even though I hate you! We loons must stick together! 
"Batman is only meaningful as an answer to a world which in its basics is chaotic and in the hands of the wrong people, where no justice can be found. I think it's very suitable to our perception of the world's condition today... Batman embodies the will to resist evil" -Frank Miller
"Conan, what's the meaning of life?"
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women!"
-Conan the Barbarian
"Well, yeah."
-Jason E. Perkins
"If I had a dime for every time Pariah was right about something I'd owe twenty cents."
-Ultimate Jaburg53
"Fair enough. I defer to your expertise."
-Prometheus
Rack MisterJLA!
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
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The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
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So you didn't actually read the discussion, and now you're getting pissy for being called out on it.
Roger.
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Joined: Jun 2004
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Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
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Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
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He won't dare defy pro's orders.
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
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Joined: May 2003
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Officially "too old for this shit" 15000+ posts
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Six whole murders listed there. The Muslims did almost that many in Afghanistan last week alone. furthermore, that's not an example of mob violence, nor were those murders sanctioned by the church (I had asked for examples of church sanctioned killings). And most importantly, it's not an example of someone being killed by a Christian over burning a Bible.
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Regenerated 15000+ posts
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Exactly. Spot on. 
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Joined: Feb 2001
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Regenerated 15000+ posts
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The fool has said in his heart, "There is no God." Atheism is aristocratic... #PariahIsAnIdiot
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Joined: Feb 2001
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Regenerated 15000+ posts
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Regenerated 15000+ posts
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LALALALALALALALI'm not gonna bother reading itLALALALALALALA
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Joined: Feb 2001
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Regenerated 15000+ posts
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The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
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The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
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"Hey this is PCG342's bro..." 15000+ posts
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"Hey this is PCG342's bro..." 15000+ posts
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LALALALALALALALI'm not gonna bother reading itLALALALALALALA He's too busy filling out the Special Forces application. In crayon.
"Are you eating it...or is it eating you?" [center] [/center] [center] [/center]
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Joined: May 2003
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Officially "too old for this shit" 15000+ posts
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