|
|
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 84
25+ posts
|
|
25+ posts
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 84 |
Hey-- a non-LEGION thread!
Next thing ya know, I'll be starting topics on DOOM PATROL and X-STATIX...!
Anyhoo, back to the topic...
It has come to my attention that A Titan (if not THE Titan) that is slated to die in GRADUATION DAY is none other than
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
P
A
C
E
Lilith. And I'm tres pissed about it.
Because of this, I shant be buying the GD mini, though I will still check out OUTSIDERS and TEEN TITANS.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 268
200+ posts
|
|
200+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 268 |
![[sad]](images/icons/frown.gif) That was a major shock for me, actually -- I saw an advance copy in my store a few days ago, and I had NO IDEA that was coming (probably because I haven't been on the new DC boards very much at all). I suppose it's still possible for them to kill DONNA TROY also in the third issue, although that would probably alienate so many readers that they shouldn't even bother starting the new series... I'm missing DOOM PATROL already. Sometimes I forget that there are still two more issues. However, I do still have the DP Archives vol. 1 to read through, and maybe they will even release an Archives vol. 2 sometime soon. I've liked X-STATIX as much now as always, but I'm a little confused as to what's happening... my subscription box last month had WOLVERINE/DOOP #1 -- is this a mini, or has it "taken over" X-STATIX for the time being? How many issues is it? I liked the art and all, but it is muy weird.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 84
25+ posts
|
|
25+ posts
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 84 |
Yeah, at first I was tickled about WOLV/DOOP because I figured it was IN ADDITION to X-Statix but it seems that ISN'T the case! That displeases me! Displeases me a LOT!!!!! ![[mwah hwah haa]](graemlins/devil.gif) Someone's gotta pay for this...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 15,367 Likes: 13
Banned from the DCMBs since 2002. 15000+ posts
|
|
Banned from the DCMBs since 2002. 15000+ posts
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 15,367 Likes: 13 |
quote:
Originally posted by MLLASH:
Lilith.
Well, I'm not too bothered by it. She was never a character which I had much regard for. I supposed that deals with the long dangling plotline of the cry-baby winged guy Azrael, too.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 985
500+ posts
|
|
500+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 985 |
I had a hunch that it be Lilith, and now it makes sense for the dead Titan to become the new Raven.
But I thought that the Titan that was dying was going to be one of the founders and that's why people assumed it was going to be Donna.
Another case of overhype...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 84
25+ posts
|
|
25+ posts
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 84 |
That's why I said "A" Titan instead of "THE" Titan...
It looks like Donna will ALSO perish...
Which totally sucks scabby ass!!!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 19,633
I walk in eternity 15000+ posts
|
|
I walk in eternity 15000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 19,633 |
Comics are Like a Box of Chocolates.... ![[biiiig grin]](images/icons/grin.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,289
2000+ posts
|
|
2000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,289 |
Less a case of over hype and more acase of over zealous fanboys foaming at the mouth looking to kill everyone at DC.
When the rumour first started the Titan boards went mental.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,524
1500+ posts
|
|
1500+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,524 |
Noooo, the TITAN boards always were mental... ![[wink]](images/icons/wink.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4
1 post
|
|
1 post
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4 |
I simply cannot believe that Donna and Lilith are going to die, and yet STARFIRE is going to survive to be in the new series! That is so unfair! I mean, besides huge knockers, what does she really have to offer the team that Donna and Lilith couldn't provide?
And I so hope that Lilith does not become the "new" Raven. Anyone besides the old Raven is going to feel wrong. I mean, Raven was her name, not her codename. It would be like Tim Drake becoming the "new" Dick Grayson.
And I can't say I much care for the theory that although the rest of the DCU will think that Donna's dead, she will really be on some other world, slaughtering aliens. I'm sorry, but that image from GD 1 in Donna's dream, where Donna is hacking into aliens with a sword just did NOT feel right. Donna may be an Amazon, but she is no killer. I find it hard to believe that she would do this.
Oh well. Very little of what DC does any more makes much sense to me, really.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 0
0 posts
|
|
0 posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 0 |
quote:
I mean, besides huge knockers, what does she really have to offer the team that Donna and Lilith couldn't provide?
Uh..... huger knockers?
Sorry. To tell you the truth, I'm glad to see the long, sad saga of Donna Troy finally come to the end it should have had back in the Crisis. What possessed the DC brass at the time to keep the character around? The past fifteen-plus years spent trying to explain and validify her existence has provided work for hundreds of comic book creators, but done little else. See ya, Donna. You were a great little second-stringer Pre-Crisis, but you never found your place in this new, sterile universe DC settled for.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 15,367 Likes: 13
Banned from the DCMBs since 2002. 15000+ posts
|
|
Banned from the DCMBs since 2002. 15000+ posts
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 15,367 Likes: 13 |
Hughest knockers! quote:
Originally posted by MLLASH:
That's why I said "A" Titan instead of "THE" Titan...
It looks like Donna will ALSO perish...
Which totally sucks scabby ass!!!
Isn't Rucka's first storyline about WW and a baby (reincarnated Donna?)?
Donna Troy's continuity is one of the reasons sane people cannot read Titans anymore.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 84
25+ posts
|
|
25+ posts
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 84 |
NO ONE ELSE cares about Lilith???
Sometimes I think I'm the Patron Saint of minor characters...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 985
500+ posts
|
|
500+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 985 |
quote:
Originally posted by MLLASH:
NO ONE ELSE cares about Lilith???
Sometimes I think I'm the Patron Saint of minor characters...
I only met Lilith after she was Omen. I didn't read Titans in the 80's, before my time...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4
1 post
|
|
1 post
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4 |
quote:
Originally posted by MLLASH:
Sometimes I think I'm the Patron Saint of minor characters...
Oddly enough, Lashie Poo, I've never really thought of you as a saint
I think the thing about "minor" characters is that there is so much untapped potential. I cringe when I hear "second stringers", as if to inply that those characters are less worthy than the "big guns". Zatanna, Black Canary and Red Tornado were considered second stringers in the JLA, because they weren't "icons". Well, who the heck wants to read stories JUST about the icons? Not me. Let's see how Superman stands up to Zatanna's magic, shall we?
Batman stories are a dime a dozen. Flamebird is a practically blank slate, just waiting for the right writer to come along and make somethign special out of her.
Jean Grey? Yawn. Give me Lilith in go-go boots, using her psychic powers to research the weirdness of the DCU (doesn't Lilith just scream "Vertigo Title?).
Golden Age Hawkman, Thanagarian Hawkman, Merged Hawkman, Tastes Great Less Filling Hawkman... blah, blah, blah. Give me Charley Parker in the Golden Eagle armor... less brooding, more high flying hottie... wings of a hawk, heart of a lion!
DC has so many great characters that deserve a chance to shine in the hands of the right creative team. I say, stop creating new, bland characters and utilize the tools you already have!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 104
100+ posts
|
|
100+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 104 |
quote:
Originally posted by Princess Crujectra:
Give me Lilith in go-go boots, using her psychic powers to research the weirdness of the DCU (doesn't Lilith just scream "Vertigo Title?).
You know that sounds like a pretty bloody good idea. She's 'normal' enough to fit into Vertigo nicely (if you see what I mean) has quite simple powers that are also pretty versatile when it comes to storytelling and in the right hands she could blossom.
Although not any more of course. The thing that's annoyed me most about the way she got killed is the fact that she feels like the only reason she was there at all was to die. OK so she had a part to play at the end of the Titans series but was she really a full member? And if not why was she really there? I know in #1 she was there to tell if the corporation guys were lying but doesn't Donna still have the ability to tell that herself just instinctivly? If that's the case then Lillith was there pretty much as a sacrificial lamb. Nothing to do with being narked that DC has killed off another female character (and seems likely to do the same again with either Donna, Argent or Empress likely to get the chop) but that they seem to have killed off a character just for the sake of killing her off. To make the story more shocking or something.
But then again the whole mini so far has left me *very* cold. The art is pretty... well, mediocre, and the writing is just poor at the best. He doesn't seem to have any hold on the YJ characters whatsoever. Robin and Wonder Girl are acting especially oddly and there have been at least two pretty big flubs with regards to them that I noticed. First off when Donna is having the chat with Cassie she says something along the lines of 'we didn't ask for these powers' or something, only... um... well, she did. that was the big point about the character when she first appeared. She wasn't gifted with powers by some accident, she activly sought them out. Sure she's ggrown a lot since then but she still asked for the gig.
And then there's the bit where Argent and Empress are in hospital. The doctor says that they're both stable but that there's only so much she can do because of their altered physiology. OK so that might be true of Argent but Empress is a regular human girl. Her powers are pretty much magic based from what we were told in YJ. She's not a metahuman, she's not an alien. So why can't the doctor work out her physiology?
To me the whole series so far just smacks of an excuse to split up the two teams and then reorganise them completely which seems a little pointless. OK so Titans sucked arse big time but maybe the group is just getting a little tired (and the writing was pretty shitty too. Although anyone see the original proposals after Devin left? They sounded pretty darn cool only for them to be completely mangled by editorial mandate) but Young justice was going along strong. peter David was doing great things with the characters, he'd made both Wonder Girl and Superboy into really interesting characters in my mind (I used to detest Cassie). He'd done some really good stuff with Arrowette and he'd created two fabulous new (female) characters in Empress and Secret (actually credit where it's due Secret was created before PAD started on the series but he's pretty much made her his own). Only then they decide to make a Titans cartoon and obviously decide the Titans comic needs to reflect that. I don't believe it when Geoff Johns says his team line up being the same was just coincidence.
Ugh, rant over. Just a shame that something that could have been quite cool has turned out even more sucky than anyone expected. ![[no no no]](graemlins/nono.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4
1 post
|
|
1 post
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4 |
Keeping in mind I haven't read the issue, and am going on hearsay only, but if Lilith HAD to die, then couldn't it have been handled a little bit better? I mean, she WAS a psychic, after all. Couldn't she have foreseen her death, but sacrficed herself heroicly to save another hero or something?
If heroes have to die, let them at least go out fighting the noble fight. They deserve that much, at least.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 34
25+ posts
|
|
25+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 34 |
quote:
Originally posted by MLLASH:
NO ONE ELSE cares about Lilith???
Sometimes I think I'm the Patron Saint of minor characters...
Lilith was my absolute favourite Titan back in the day when she was first introduced and I actually read other comics besides Legion stuff.
Sorry to hear about her death. I must have a thing for red-headed women 'cause I always preferred Lana Lang to Lois Lane and Lilith to Wonder Girl.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 7
1 post
|
|
1 post
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 7 |
I thought Lilith was promoted to junior goddess, who can't normally be killed. Or was she unpromoted? ... Or am I, as is usual, many years out of date on such reading?
Death is too casual a comics event, and too rarely sticking, for my reading tastes. She'll be back.
And, yes ... redheads RULE!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4
1 post
|
|
1 post
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 4 |
quote:
Originally posted by Greybird:
I thought Lilith was promoted to junior goddess, who can't normally be killed. Or was she unpromoted? ... Or am I, as is usual, many years out of date on such reading?
She was, when her mother was revealed to be the goddess Thia, I believe, in the "Children of the Sun" storyline. Somewhere along the way, though, that seems to have been changed. I think it was during the second "Who Is Donna Troy" storyline, when they tried to fix Donna's origin after Wonder Woman was rebooted. In this story, Thia was seen to be alive and living out in space with the other Titans of Myth.
Or did CotS happen after WIDTp2? I dunno. Somehow Lilith lost that goddess feeling, and was retconned to being the daughter of Loren Jupiter, and somehow got extra powers. Her new mother has yet to be revealed.
Titans continuity isn't really all it's cracked up to be, sometimes. Kinda like the Legion
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 520
500+ posts
|
|
500+ posts
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 520 |
quote:
Originally posted by Dave:
quote:
Originally posted by MLLASH:
Lilith.
Well, I'm not too bothered by it. She was never a character which I had much regard for. I supposed that deals with the long dangling plotline of the cry-baby winged guy Azrael, too.
With my luck, he'll be back to grieve in OUTSIDERS for about eight or nine issues.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 192
100+ posts
|
|
100+ posts
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 192 |
quote:
Originally posted by MLLASH:
That's why I said "A" Titan instead of "THE" Titan...
It looks like Donna will ALSO perish...
Which totally sucks scabby ass!!!
Lash, trust me mate... It isn't going to be as bad as you think. We may not have our Prima Donna around, but she isn't going to be joining Lilith in the big Titan's Tower in the sky. Argent on the other hand...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,134
Knowledge is Power! 1000+ posts
|
|
Knowledge is Power! 1000+ posts
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,134 |
quote:
Originally posted by Princess Crujectra:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by MLLASH:
[qb]I think the thing about "minor" characters is that there is so much untapped potential. I cringe when I hear "second stringers", as if to inply that those characters are less worthy than the "big guns". Zatanna, Black Canary and Red Tornado were considered second stringers in the JLA, because they weren't "icons". Well, who the heck wants to read stories JUST about the icons? Not me. Let's see how Superman stands up to Zatanna's magic, shall we?
Here, Here!
I agree, Princess. How many time have "second stringers" had to help out the JLR and save the DCU?
Though I like the icon members in the JLA (Supes, Bats, WW, Aquaman, Flash, GL & Martain Manhunter), the JLR should be bigger than these seven charecters.
It makes more sense to me for the JLA to have a bigger membership (drawing on past JLA members, the JSA and old/new DCU charecters).
Like in the satalite years, not every member should respond to every emergancy (due to other life commitments). To me that would make the JLA more interesting than the same handful of heroes saving the world several times a week.
That's my rant over...
:)
Ta!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32,001 Likes: 1
We already are 15000+ posts
|
|
We already are 15000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32,001 Likes: 1 |
I won't miss her.....I never got into the character. ![[izzat so?]](graemlins/zatso.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 22,618
Your death will make me king! 15000+ posts
|
|
Your death will make me king! 15000+ posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 22,618 |
quote:
Originally posted by Britannica:
Here, Here!
I agree, Princess. How many time have "second stringers" had to help out the JLR and save the DCU?...
Dude, I think you're having a brain fart. We've never saved the DCU... yet.
|
|
|
|
|
