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Quote:
Pariah said:
You're talking about adopting.
Really?
I am shocked to know that my children are not biologically my children.
If I were to marry a man today, I would not be giving up any of my parental obligations.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
Gay people do actually hold down jobs and raise children. Therefore, they're as much a contributing part of the economy/society as anyone else. And their morale is effected by being limited in rights.
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You're talking about adopting. In which case, people are given help from the government to raise that child depending on whether or not they need it. So there's no need for a tax-cut there.
no, i'm talking about gay people being members of society in every way that straight people are. i'm talking about raising kids (yes, adopting. but still raising kids.) and i'm talking about them working and supporting the economy.
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And if their rights are limited, same as blacks in the south circa 1960, then we'll end up with the same sort of protests that happened in the south (the bus boycott alone hurt the economy of the region).
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Once again: Marriage isn't a right.
it is if you have to go to the government for a license to do it. if marriage was strictly a church matter then gay marriage wouldn't be an issue. but once the government got involved it became a right that everyone should have.
Bow ties are coool.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Once again: Marriage isn't a right.
Neither was black men voting until we came to our senses and stated it explicitly in the Constitution. That's what the Constitution is for, for us to realize and state rights that our Founders didn't think of.
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Quote:
Jim Jackson said:
This logic has already been shot down by r3x.
Gay people work and raise children.
Gay people working was never the issue. The fact that they have no chance of having kids without preparing for them adequately beforehand means your argument is full of shit. And what's more, the ones that aren't adequately repaired get help by the government anyway.
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And many str8 marrieds do not raise children.
Stop trying to create averages that aren't there. "Many" straights who don't raise children aren't the majority of straights who do. And also, those "many" straights still mainly hone the ability to have potential families. Which is one of the larger reasons for benefits among straights.
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Now, by your logic, those str8s who are married but have no children should be compelled to divorce or have their marriages legally annulled because they do not meet one of your criteria for being married.
No. As I said before, you're creating averages that aren't there. This is system is based on majority. Maximum efficiency. In the case of straights, such a marriage is a finagle. Not illegal.
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Further, those str8s who are married but struggle with their "consumerists abilities" should be compelled to divorce or have their marriages legally annulled because they do not meet one of your criteria for being married.
The criteria consists of ability to have kids.
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Quote:
Jim Jackson said:
Really?
I am shocked to know that my children are not biologically my children.
If I were to marry a man today, I would not be giving up any of my parental obligations.
Does this mean you had to give up your benefits when you were divorced? If that's the case, it's not the government's fault, but your own since you left your wife...Or hers for leaving you--I dunno.
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r3x29yz4a said:
no, i'm talking about gay people being members of society in every way that straight people are. i'm talking about raising kids (yes, adopting. but still raising kids.) and i'm talking about them working and supporting the economy.
And them working and supporting the economy was never the issue. The fact of the matter is, they're supported for kids either way. And you're little ad hominem isn't gonna change that.
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it is if you have to go to the government for a license to do it. if marriage was strictly a church matter then gay marriage wouldn't be an issue. but once the government got involved it became a right that everyone should have.
No. It didn't. The institution of marriage in the case of government is most specifically, according to government policy, not a right.
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Pariah said:
The criteria consists of ability to have kids.
So those str8s who are married but unable to bear their biological children are now exempt from marriage.
Riiight.
The hole keeps getting deeper, m'boy.
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Quote:
Jim Jackson said:
Quote:
Pariah said:
The criteria consists of ability to have kids.
So those str8s who are married but unable to bear their biological children are now exempt from marriage.
Riiight.
The hole keeps getting deeper, m'boy.
good point but you might want to rethink that last line before BSAMS sees it.
Bow ties are coool.
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Quote:
Jim Jackson said:
Neither was black men voting until we came to our senses and stated it explicitly in the Constitution. That's what the Constitution is for, for us to realize and state rights that our Founders didn't think of.
Yeah, you tried that bullshit before. Didn't work for a very good reason.
I'm sorryf if you can't come to terms with the fact that gay marriage isn't compatible with the marital policy, but a person's right to vote is in no way comparable to the privilege of marriage. You dragging the minorities into this is just an example of your flaming desparity.
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Quote:
Jim Jackson said:
So those str8s who are married but unable to bear their biological children are now exempt from marriage.
Nope. Their problem is medical. Yours isn't. It's flawed reasoning to say that just because one thing doesn't work the way it's supposed to (infertility in couples) that-that validates mis-use of sex and policy by others (homosexual couples who want marriage benefits).
I know a couple who weren't able to concieve almost a decade ago who're were able to now due to a medical breakthrough.
Last edited by Pariah; 2005-08-18 7:38 PM.
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Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
Quote:
Jim Jackson said:
Quote:
Pariah said:
The criteria consists of ability to have kids.
So those str8s who are married but unable to bear their biological children are now exempt from marriage.
Riiight.
The hole keeps getting deeper, m'boy.
good point but you might want to rethink that last line before BSAMS sees it.
I'm not going to self-censor for his benefit. Nothing he says will be newsworthy anyway.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Quote:
Jim Jackson said:
This logic has already been shot down by r3x.
Gay people work and raise children.
Gay people working was never the issue. The fact that they have no chance of having kids without preparing for them adequately beforehand means your argument is full of shit. And what's more, the ones that aren't adequately repaired get help by the government anyway.
Quote:
And many str8 marrieds do not raise children.
Stop trying to create averages that aren't there. "Many" straights who don't raise children aren't the majority of straights who do. And also, those "many" straights still mainly hone the ability to have potential families. Which is one of the larger reasons for benefits among straights.
but with the population double what it was 25 years ago, and still growing rapidly, is it efficient at all to encourage people to have more and more children?
and aren't gay marriages an efficient idea because once married they'd be more inclined to adopt children and give those children a better chance at college and being more productive in the economy?
Bow ties are coool.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Quote:
Jim Jackson said:
So those str8s who are married but unable to bear their biological children are now exempt from marriage.
Nope. Their problem is medical. Yours isn't. It's flawed reasoning to say that just because one thing doesn't work the way it's supposed to (infertility in couples) that-that validates mis-use of sex and policy by others (homosexual couples who want marriage benefits).
I know a couple who weren't able to concieve almost a decade ago who're were able to now due to a medical breakthrough.
come on, pariah. you know if they found some way for gay men to have babies and lesbians to ejaculate semen you'd still be opposed.
Bow ties are coool.
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Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
but with the population double what it was 25 years ago, and still growing rapidly, is it efficient at all to encourage people to have more and more children?
The point of the system doesn't encourage more kids. It helps prepare for those kids and to make sure they grow up to be good and balanced citizens.
Quote:
and aren't gay marriages an efficient idea because once married they'd be more inclined to adopt children and give those children a better chance at college and being more productive in the economy?
You really have a short memory don't you? I'm not sure where you get the idea that they'd be "more inclined" to adopt children when they're married. They can just get a civil union or merge their funds and power of attorneys. And in the end, the government still helps pay for those adopted kids.
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Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
come on, pariah. you know if they found some way for gay men to have babies and lesbians to ejaculate semen you'd still be opposed.
We'll just wait until that scenario happens so I can better understand the circumstances of the situation.
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Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
and aren't gay marriages an efficient idea because once married they'd be more inclined to adopt children and give those children a better chance at college and being more productive in the economy?
Another solid point about efficiencies.
There have been biological theories/positions advanced that take the position that homosexuality is a kind of biological control on species overpopulation.
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Quote:
Jim Jackson said:
There have been biological theories/positions advanced that take the position that homosexuality is a kind of biological control on species overpopulation.
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Oh, sure, that theory's ridiculous, but a carpenter getting resurrected is no big deal....
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You know, I just don't get it. Why do people care about who other people marry? Who and which holes get plugged in the privacy of peoples' bedrooms is no body elses business. When I was married I never felt threatened by same sex marriage. Let people love whom they want to love and declare that love publicly. Same sex couples deserve the same rights as straight couples. Who would it harm?
"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives." John Stuart Mill
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He who dies with the most toys is nonetheless dead.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
but with the population double what it was 25 years ago, and still growing rapidly, is it efficient at all to encourage people to have more and more children?
Quote:
The point of the system doesn't encourage more kids. It helps prepare for those kids and to make sure they grow up to be good and balanced citizens.
but what about single mothers/fathers? they can raise their kids just fine, and so can gay people.
kids grow up "balanced" based on the way they're treated and the things they're taught. two decent gay people will raise as good a kid as two decent straight people or one single straight person.
Quote:
and aren't gay marriages an efficient idea because once married they'd be more inclined to adopt children and give those children a better chance at college and being more productive in the economy?
You really have a short memory don't you? I'm not sure where you get the idea that they'd be "more inclined" to adopt children when they're married. They can just get a civil union or merge their funds and power of attorneys. And in the end, the government still helps pay for those adopted kids.
okay, pariah. gay marriage is a tax scam.
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Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
okay, pariah. gay marriage is a tax scam.
And a very serious health risk. Fuck...we really need to start rounding these faggots up and gassing the little fuckers. They are going to ruin the world for normal 'Fight Club' worshipers everywhere.
If karma's a bitch, it will be my bitch!
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Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
okay, pariah. gay marriage is a tax scam.
Yes! He can be taught!
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Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
come on, pariah. you know if they found some way for gay men to have babies and lesbians to ejaculate semen you'd still be opposed.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Quote:
Jim Jackson said:
There have been biological theories/positions advanced that take the position that homosexuality is a kind of biological control on species overpopulation.
Not smart to laugh at your origins, you lil' pecker-snapper.
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Origins? What origins do you speak of?
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
okay, pariah. gay marriage is a tax scam.
Yes! He can be taught!
i like your christian view of things where everyone is as corrupt as you
Bow ties are coool.
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Quote:
magicjay38 said:
Let people love whom they want to love and declare that love publicly. Same sex couples deserve the same rights as straight couples. Who would it harm?
Pariah.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Origins? What origins do you speak of?
Just come out of the closet. Like Dahmer, anyone with that much hate and bile and prejudice in their is obviously to distance themselves from their sexual orientation.
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Presumably Lesbian couples can marry cos they can get a sperm donor and raise children?
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Quote:
Wednesday said:
Quote:
magicjay38 said:
Let people love whom they want to love and declare that love publicly. Same sex couples deserve the same rights as straight couples. Who would it harm?
Pariah.
How about if we all promise to stay far away (very far away) from his anus?
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He's got two of 'em...could be tough!
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Quote:
theory9 said:
He's got two of 'em...could be tough!
if that's an assface joke, i approve
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Quote:
Steve T said:
Presumably Lesbian couples can marry cos they can get a sperm donor and raise children?
Again. There's no way a child would be unpredictable within that relationship. And because the benefits are in place as a protocol for unplanned or earlier-than-expected as well as planned child-birth, it's deemed void for lesbian couples.
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Quote:
Steve T said:
Presumably Lesbian couples can marry cos they can get a sperm donor and raise children?
Again. There's no way a child would be unpredictable within that relationship. And because the benefits are in place as a protocol for unplanned or earlier-than-expected as well as planned child-birth, it's deemed void for lesbian couples.
I think that straight couples are just as likely to be fucked up as gay couples.
Of course, having "god hates fags" fellows like yourself in their face may add a stress factor.
Bow ties are coool.
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Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
I think that straight couples are just as likely to be fucked up as gay couples.
It's not a matter of considering whether or not kids are going to be put with anyone who's imbalanced. Obviously anyone can be deranged. The reason a child being had under a man and a woman is more orthodox is because it's best to have both influences.
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..by whose standards should both influences be favored?
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Quote:
Pariah said:
Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
I think that straight couples are just as likely to be fucked up as gay couples.
It's not a matter of considering whether or not kids are going to be put with anyone who's imbalanced. Obviously anyone can be deranged. The reason a child being had under a man and a woman is more orthodox is because it's best to have both influences.
You are living proof that woman & possum can procreate, poopy pants!
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Schwarzenegger to decide on gay marriageHISTORIC VOTE: California lawmakers became the first in the country to approve a bill allowing same-sex marriages.
UNCERTAIN FUTURE: Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger could veto the measure, though. He has said the issue should be decided by voters or the courts.
CURRENT RIGHTS: California already gives same-sex couples many of the rights and duties of marriage if they register with the state as domestic partners.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
Schwarzenegger to decide on gay marriage
HISTORIC VOTE: California lawmakers became the first in the country to approve a bill allowing same-sex marriages.
UNCERTAIN FUTURE: Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger could veto the measure, though. He has said the issue should be decided by voters or the courts.
CURRENT RIGHTS: California already gives same-sex couples many of the rights and duties of marriage if they register with the state as domestic partners.
This will be a very tough call for the Guvrnator. Whatever choice he makes, he's fucked. He signs it, he loses the Central Valley, the Inland Empire, and the Southern Coastal counties from OC to the Mexican boarder. A veto will cost him dearly in Los Angeles, the largest population region in the in the state. It won't cost him much in the San Francisco Bay Area either way. He was never popular up here.
The question is does he want to pursue a national agenda or retain the governorship? Signing it will kill his chances with fundy Republicans. The veto will kill him in the state race. To get elected to statewide office you've got to carry at least one of the population centres: LA or SF. His chances respectivly are slim to none with the veto.
"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives." John Stuart Mill
America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between. Oscar Wilde
He who dies with the most toys is nonetheless dead.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
CURRENT RIGHTS: California already gives same-sex couples many of the rights and duties of marriage if they register with the state as domestic partners.[/LIST]
Many is an abstract term.
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