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quote:
Originally posted by Matt Kennedy:
quote:
Originally posted by Wingnut-EL:
So after you guys get guns banned are you gonna go after all those evil fishermen roaming around. They're obviously a bunch of sick bastards who delight in sticking sharp metal hooks in poor animals mouths & then dragging them around in the water by their lips. Then after the vile fishermen tire of torturing these poor defensless critters they just let them suffacate. Oh, the horror.
I never said anything about banning guns, Wingnutt. In fact, i'm against gun control (with the exception of automatic assault rifles, as i mentioned a minute ago). All i said in my earlier posts was that i despised so-called "sport" hunters.
_____
* Are you one of those flat-earth hold-outs who still believe that fish don't feel pain? Just curious.
I don't much like "sport hunters" - I have recently found out that you can still go to Africa and shoot a leopard as sport - its actually legal!
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Yes it's legal, and I'm pretty sure most of the countries in Africa that allow it are doing it as a wildlife-saving initiative. In an attempt to preserve what little wildlife they have left, and in the face of apathetic authorities, they are making the animals "valuable". Not "valuable" in the sense you and I might use the term... but valuable in the sense that the authorities have to sit up and take notice of the conservationists because now there is a lucrative market, ie. hunters paying through the nose to come and kill a leopard. They are trying to change the so-what attitude towards poachers by sacrificing some of the animals to rich sportsmen; the poachers are now violating an economic resource.
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Matt, thanks for your posts.
In regards to whether or not meat is a necessary part of man's diet, you may be right. We've been raised to believe that meat is a major food group, it's part of the pyramid, it's healthy (and, in moderation, all this is true. It is healthy. It has nutrients and such). Whether it's a hundred percent necessary, well, I haven't done as much research as you apparently have on the subject. Though I will check out those links you posted. Seriously. Vegetarianism is something I have considered in the past... and a little research couldn't hurt.
Fishing follows the same arguments as hunting. Fishing for food is a vastly different thing to fishing for sport. One is a necessity (okay, okay... see above). One is just barbaric.
Back to gun control. Deaths from guns have decreased dramatically here since tougher gun regulations were introduced a few years ago in the wake of the massacre that Dave mentioned. And for all your crying out about constitutional rights and freedom of big fuck-off weaponry, less death-by-splattering is only a good thing.
And you can't use the 'un-American' argument against me! I'm Australian! HA! Checkmate!
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quote:
Danny:
I'm Australian!
You have my commiserations.
But don't worry too much about it, mate. Nobody's perfect.
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quote:
Originally posted by Doc Demian:
quote:
Danny:
I'm Australian!
You have my commiserations.
But don't worry too much about it, mate. Nobody's perfect.
Not perfect, but less likely to get shot over it.
quote:
Back to gun control. Deaths from guns have decreased dramatically here since tougher gun regulations were introduced a few years ago in the wake of the massacre that Dave mentioned. And for all your crying out about constitutional rights and freedom of big fuck-off weaponry, less death-by-splattering is only a good thing.
Years after I first started debating this, I still find it hard to believe that gun manufacturers could have instilled this sort of culture in a people. "Fear your government, so have an automatic weapon."
Iraqis were one of the most armed peoples on the planet, and it didn't save them from tyranny, nor from foreign invasion.
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Peacock Teaser 3000+ posts
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quote:
Originally posted by Matt Kennedy:
I'm not a vegan just because i love cuddly wuddly lil' critters. I was blind-sided by pure REASON, not emotion. I'm just a regular guy who became a vegan after reading a massive amount of info on the subject from a variety of sources.
Hey that's fine. Although judging by your Aviator (the image is of my rabbit, Dakota Ben-Hur), you do like some. ![[wink]](images/icons/wink.gif) I read sources and quit being a vegatarian, lol. But I will post some topics on animal cruelty/meat comsumption (perhaps two topics might be better) so we can stick to gun control.
A lot of good arguements have been made on both sides. To summerize the points I want to address:
Pros:
Self defense
Constitutional Right (US arguement)
Enjoyment, Food, Collectable
Business and Industry
Cons:
Letal long-range weapon
Easy to get
Misused and Abused
The trick is, there need to be retrictions. That can be said of any right. And like many rights, the addition of so many state and federal laws has created a legal nightmare. Now Dave, you are in the legal business, and you have probably seen the best and the worst of the law. I think we need some sort of a reboot of many state and federal laws (sort of a 'Ulitimate US Constitution' for you comic-book fans). Make guns hard to aquire. There are many ways you can do this. Have everyone take some classes on gun ownership--safety, laws, and protocol. Something will have to be done about pawn shops and online sellers. We have a law in Florida by Governer Bush called '10-20-Life'.
(from http://www.dc.state.fl.us/pub/10-20-life/):
This landmark public-safety reform requires a mandatory sentence of at least 10 years in state prison for any criminal who is convicted of possessing a gun while committing a violent felony such as robbery, rape [sexual battery,] aggravated battery, kidnapping, drug trafficking, and murder. If the criminal actually shoots a gun while committing the crime, Governor Bush's 10-20-Life initiative requires a minimum-mandatory sentence of 20 years in state prison. If the criminal uses the gun to shoot another person and causes serious bodily injury or death, the Governor's 10-20-Life initiative requires the courts to impose a mandatory sentence of at least 25 years and up to life in state prison.
This shows the two campaigns of gun control, leading to responsible gun ownership: tough aquiring of said weapon and harsher penalties for being caught with an illegal weapon. On a similar front, animal hunting can have restrictions so that animal populations are not desimated, but hunters (both the trohpy and the eating kind) can catch some animals.
This is important to me because I am a responsible gun user. I do not own my own, I just borrow my dad's. I don't want a posse of idiots that stole weapons and use them to terrorize people leave a black mark on a time-honor hobby that I maintain to dignify. I will have to get some pics of me on my website, me in my top gun jacket and sunglasses shooting a S&W or a Sig. That'll change some of your opinions on gun control!
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quote:
Originally posted by Danny:
Matt, thanks for your posts.
In regards to whether or not meat is a necessary part of man's diet, you may be right. We've been raised to believe that meat is a major food group, it's part of the pyramid, it's healthy (and, in moderation, all this is true. It is healthy. It has nutrients and such). Whether it's a hundred percent necessary, well, I haven't done as much research as you apparently have on the subject. Though I will check out those links you posted. Seriously. Vegetarianism is something I have considered in the past... and a little research couldn't hurt.
Fishing follows the same arguments as hunting. Fishing for food is a vastly different thing to fishing for sport. One is a necessity (okay, okay... see above). One is just barbaric.
Back to gun control. Deaths from guns have decreased dramatically here since tougher gun regulations were introduced a few years ago in the wake of the massacre that Dave mentioned. And for all your crying out about constitutional rights and freedom of big fuck-off weaponry, less death-by-splattering is only a good thing.
And you can't use the 'un-American' argument against me! I'm Australian! HA! Checkmate!
Yeah, stricter regulations on gun ownership (for ALL countries) would definitely be a good thing. And a manditory course on gun safety for all new gun owners would be nice, too.
_________________________________________
Danny, thanks for the kind words about my earlier posts, bro. I hope you do check out those links when you get a chance, and I really think you would enjoy that "Animal Liberation" book i mentioned a while back. The guy who wrote it, Peter Singer, is a highly-respected philosopher AND an Australian.
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quote:
Originally posted by Captain Sammitch:
I could give that book another once-over but I don't think it'd really change my mind. Still, I'll be careful not to offend any vegans that might be lurking out there...
I hear ya, Cap. It's a damn interesting, eye-opening book whether you decide to go vegan or not after reading it. And don't worry about offending those "lurking vegans" out there. We vegans are a tough-skinned lot for the most part--- we've gotta be.
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quote:
Originally posted by Cowgirl Jack:
quote:
Originally posted by Matt Kennedy:
I'm not a vegan just because i love cuddly wuddly lil' critters. I was blind-sided by pure REASON, not emotion. I'm just a regular guy who became a vegan after reading a massive amount of info on the subject from a variety of sources.
Hey that's fine. Although judging by your Aviator (the image is of my rabbit, Dakota Ben-Hur), you do like some. I read sources and quit being a vegatarian, lol. But I will post some topics on animal cruelty/meat comsumption (perhaps two topics might be better) so we can stick to gun control.
A lot of good arguements have been made on both sides. To summerize the points I want to address:
Pros:
Self defense
Constitutional Right (US arguement)
Enjoyment, Food, Collectable
Business and Industry
Cons:
Letal long-range weapon
Easy to get
Misused and Abused
The trick is, there need to be retrictions. That can be said of any right. And like many rights, the addition of so many state and federal laws has created a legal nightmare. Now Dave, you are in the legal business, and you have probably seen the best and the worst of the law. I think we need some sort of a reboot of many state and federal laws (sort of a 'Ulitimate US Constitution' for you comic-book fans). Make guns hard to aquire. There are many ways you can do this. Have everyone take some classes on gun ownership--safety, laws, and protocol. Something will have to be done about pawn shops and online sellers. We have a law in Florida by Governer Bush called '10-20-Life'.
(from http://www.dc.state.fl.us/pub/10-20-life/):
This landmark public-safety reform requires a mandatory sentence of at least 10 years in state prison for any criminal who is convicted of possessing a gun while committing a violent felony such as robbery, rape [sexual battery,] aggravated battery, kidnapping, drug trafficking, and murder. If the criminal actually shoots a gun while committing the crime, Governor Bush's 10-20-Life initiative requires a minimum-mandatory sentence of 20 years in state prison. If the criminal uses the gun to shoot another person and causes serious bodily injury or death, the Governor's 10-20-Life initiative requires the courts to impose a mandatory sentence of at least 25 years and up to life in state prison.
This shows the two campaigns of gun control, leading to responsible gun ownership: tough aquiring of said weapon and harsher penalties for being caught with an illegal weapon. On a similar front, animal hunting can have restrictions so that animal populations are not desimated, but hunters (both the trohpy and the eating kind) can catch some animals.
This is important to me because I am a responsible gun user. I do not own my own, I just borrow my dad's. I don't want a posse of idiots that stole weapons and use them to terrorize people leave a black mark on a time-honor hobby that I maintain to dignify. I will have to get some pics of me on my website, me in my top gun jacket and sunglasses shooting a S&W or a Sig. That'll change some of your opinions on gun control!
Hey, Jacklyn! It's good to see ya over here on Rob's boards. And you're right: i actually DO like cuddly wuddly lil' critters...
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Banned from the DCMBs since 2002. 15000+ posts
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Banned from the DCMBs since 2002. 15000+ posts
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 15,367 Likes: 13 |
quote:
Originally posted by Cowgirl Jack:
Now Dave, you are in the legal business, and you have probably seen the best and the worst of the law. I think we need some sort of a reboot of many state and federal laws (sort of a 'Ulitimate US Constitution' for you comic-book fans). Make guns hard to aquire. There are many ways you can do this. Have everyone take some classes on gun ownership--safety, laws, and protocol. Something will have to be done about pawn shops and online sellers.
Classes on gun safety is a very very good idea, Jack.
As for a reboot of the Constitution, you'd be hard pressed to get a consensus to do it, I'm afraid...
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Better late than never!   quote:
Originally posted by Dave:
Given guns are pretty hard to get in the first place, there aren't too many criminals with high powered weapons. Sawn-off shotguns are about as worse as it gets.
Most guns come into the possession of criminals from being stolen from homes (same in the US, I recall).
I don't know, my dad has been shot at with an assortment of various weapons. I'll see if I can dig up the stats to the types of weapons.
As far as how criminals get weapons, I don't think they steal from a home. The gun safe we have is near impossible to break into, and its not like we spent a lot of money on it (my dad is cheap sometimes lol). Pawn shops are the real culprit. Doesn't matter what you buy there -- guns, tools, musical instrument -- they are probably all stolen. And now with internet purchases, I wonder if places like e-bay is going to be just as bad.
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Wow...I post a pic with my ass in the air and no comments. I must have lost my mojo... ![[sad]](images/icons/frown.gif)
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cobra kai 15000+ posts
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cobra kai 15000+ posts
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you are in the process of shooting
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"Hey this is PCG342's bro..." 15000+ posts
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quote:
Originally posted by Wingnut-EL:
So after you guys get guns banned are you gonna go after all those evil fishermen roaming around. They're obviously a bunch of sick bastards who delight in sticking sharp metal hooks in poor animals mouths & then dragging them around in the water by their lips. Then after the vile fishermen tire of torturing these poor defensless critters they just let them suffacate. Oh, the horror.
I never said anything about banning guns, Wingnutt. In fact, i'm against gun control (with the exception of automatic assault rifles, as i mentioned a minute ago). All i said in my earlier posts was that i despised so-called "sport" hunters.
_____
* Are you one of those flat-earth hold-outs who still believe that fish don't feel pain? Just curious. You tell 'em, Pariah Carey!
"Are you eating it...or is it eating you?" [center] ![[Linked Image from i13.photobucket.com]](http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a275/captainsammitch/boards/banners/blogban3.jpg) [/center] [center] ![[Linked Image from i13.photobucket.com]](http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a275/captainsammitch/boards/banners/jlamiska.jpg) [/center]
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fudge 4000+ posts
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guns bad! cannons good 
 Racks be to MisterJLA
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fudge 4000+ posts
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fudge 4000+ posts
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Wow...I post a pic with my ass in the air and no comments. I must have lost my mojo... <img border="0" title="" alt="[sad]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> oh, and, y'know, better late than never, but your ass IS slightly to the side, so people can't really get a good view...
Racks be to MisterJLA
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I've been ass-king in my prayers for this. 
This is not vengeance. This is pun-ishment.
"The goodness of the true pun is in the direct ratio of its intolerability." — Edgar Allan Poe
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1 Millionth Customer 10000+ posts
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I've been ass-king in my prayers for this. i would've been more impressed with some sort of camel-toe pun.
Bow ties are coool.
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i would've been more impressed with some sort of camel-toe pun.
Yeah, but the llama-ntable truth is that she wasn't showing it.
This is not vengeance. This is pun-ishment.
"The goodness of the true pun is in the direct ratio of its intolerability." — Edgar Allan Poe
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Ignored by 3 users and 2 moderators 4000+ posts
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rex User daffy asshole
15000+ posts Wed Jan 02 2008 07:30 PM Reading a post
Forum: Politics and Current Events
Thread: gun control
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Unbreakable 3000+ posts
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One more thing and then I promise to shut up for the night. If you guys want to read THE fucking book on Animal Rights/veganism please go to your local library and check out a copy of Peter Singer's "Animal Liberation". I'm dead serious, this book will fucking flat-out blow you away, gang. Whether you choose to go vegan or not, I guarantee you'll never look at "food animals" in quite the same way ever again after reading this book. This bad boy covers EVERY possible angle connected to animal rights/veganism (ethics, environmental issues, historical over-views and examinations of meat-eating throughout the ages, accounts of standard factory-farm and slaughterhouse practices, etc., etc., etc.,). Man, I just can't stress enough how compelling and important this book is, so please give it a shot the next time you're looking for something good to read, y'all. <End of wild-eyed PETA nutter transmission--- you may now go back to calling each other "donkey-fuckers" and such-like <img border="0" title="" alt="  " src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> > Peter Singer is a fascist who isn't worthy to lick Immanuel Kant's feet.
"Batman is only meaningful as an answer to a world which in its basics is chaotic and in the hands of the wrong people, where no justice can be found. I think it's very suitable to our perception of the world's condition today... Batman embodies the will to resist evil" -Frank Miller
"Conan, what's the meaning of life?"
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women!"
-Conan the Barbarian
"Well, yeah."
-Jason E. Perkins
"If I had a dime for every time Pariah was right about something I'd owe twenty cents."
-Ultimate Jaburg53
"Fair enough. I defer to your expertise."
-Prometheus
Rack MisterJLA!
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Unbreakable 3000+ posts
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Wow...I post a pic with my ass in the air and no comments. I must have lost my mojo... <img border="0" title="" alt="[sad]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> oh, and, y'know, better late than never, but your ass IS slightly to the side, so people can't really get a good view... Chant tells the truth.
"Batman is only meaningful as an answer to a world which in its basics is chaotic and in the hands of the wrong people, where no justice can be found. I think it's very suitable to our perception of the world's condition today... Batman embodies the will to resist evil" -Frank Miller
"Conan, what's the meaning of life?"
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women!"
-Conan the Barbarian
"Well, yeah."
-Jason E. Perkins
"If I had a dime for every time Pariah was right about something I'd owe twenty cents."
-Ultimate Jaburg53
"Fair enough. I defer to your expertise."
-Prometheus
Rack MisterJLA!
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