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 Does anyone care which one it is called? Is calling it Christmas season offensive to non-christians? Is calling it holiday season offensive to christians? Or does it matter?
Last edited by rex; 2007-11-15 8:32 PM.
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Quote:
rex said:
Does anyone care which one it is called? Is calling it Christmas season offensive to non-christians?
Is calling it holiday season offensive to christians? Or does it matter?
i dont really care which one people say, anyone who takes offence to either one is a fucktard
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though at one point the holiest of holy, sacrediest of sacred... christmas, at least in america, has lost most, if not all, of its soverignty. if you wanna consider it a shopping season, a decorative season, a family gathering season... they're all apt.
but the notion that it is a religious holiday is more or less over, and that isn't necessarily a bad thing, especially if the latter, afore mentioned atribute denoting family/friend orientation is what is being pushed.
christmas is, really, the american holiday. not that its not celebrated elsewhere or even that its celebrated not as large elsewhere ... i just mean that everyone in america seems to celebrate christmas, whether they're supposed to or not.
many of my friends growing up were jewish or athiest or asian or whatever. certainly not christian, or anything resembling. but it didn't matter, they'd still watch all the christmas specials on tv. they'd still enjoy, and even partake, in the decorating. its not at all uncommon for a jewish family to have a christmas tree (or plant, at least).
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This has always been a strange topic for me because I feel that it should be called Christmas holiday, but since it includes thanksgiving and new years, I also feel it should be called the holiday season. I know the politically correct thing is holiday season and I usually go against political correctness, but I don't think its that big of a deal.
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I don't care either way, although since Christmas seems to be the most popular and dominant holiday this time of year, I guess "Christmas season" is more appropriate. The fact that Chanukah falls at the same time (and on the 25th of the Hebrew month of Kislev) is coincidence.
Besides, Chanukah isn't meant to be a counterpart to Christmas in any way, shape or form. The part about giving out presents on each night is an American tradition that secular Jews came up with to appease Jewish kids who didn't get Christmas presents and felt left out.
If anything, Chanukah has more in common with Thanksgiving than Christmas, since it's primarily a celebration of our right to practice our faith, and Chanukah sometimes falls much closer to Thanksgiving than it does to Christmas. We commemorate Chanukah to remember that a foreign power tried to outlaw our faith and forcibly convert us to theirs, but we fought back and won, so we give thanks to G-d for that victory. To me, that's much more important than the miracle of the oil that followed the military victory.
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Quote:
rex said:
This has always been a strange topic for me because I feel that it should be called Christmas holiday, but since it includes thanksgiving and new years, I also feel it should be called the holiday season. I know the politically correct thing is holiday season and I usually go against political correctness, but I don't think its that big of a deal.
Technically, the time from Thanksgiving to New Years is the Holiday Season, but when you're talking about the specific holidays, they should be refered to as Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Years, Kwanza, etc.
I really hate political correctness, it makes my job that much more difficult because we can't have cards that depict ANYTHING Christmasy, not even secular Christmas themes, like a wreath or tree. I just want to reach through the phone and slap people when they say they can't choose which ever card for really stupid reasons like that. They don't want to offend someone. You know, it's not worth passing up very nice cards just because there's something Christmasy on it.
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I'm catholic and I use them interchangably really. I'm also specific. If it's closer to Thanksgiving/Christmas/New Years, I'll make that indication. If anyone has a problem with it...well tough. They need to get the stick out their butt and enjoy the spirit of the season.
Merry Christmas everyone!
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I'm not Christian but still celebrate it as a tradition and hate the idea that in some places you aren't allowed to call it Christmas. I also hate the fact that the idiots and the bigots in this world use it as an excuse to spout shit about minorities as if it's their fault. I've yet to meet a non Christian who gives a shit whether we celebrate Christmas or not. These orders always come down from some over sensitive, middle class, white guy in an office somewhere. Fuckin' liberals 
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I've always called the time from Halloween to New Years' "the holiday season" cuz there's more than one holiday in there, ya heard? And I call everything from the day after Thanksgiving to Christmas Eve the "the holiday shopping season" cuz that's what I've always heard it called. It isn't a PC thing, it's just what I'm used to.
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Quote:
rex said:
Does anyone care which one it is called? Is calling it Christmas season offensive to non-christians?
I look at it like this...while others, inside and outside the U.S, may deride any American culture, I do think there is an American culture. And Christmas is a part of that culture, EVEN IF you don't believe in Jesus as a savior or any of the J-C theology. Christmas is a coming together of families, a remembrance of times past and friends and loved ones gone, a season of sharing to share with your children, family, and friends.
As a non-Christian, I am not at all offended by calling the season the Christmas season.
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Quote:
Rob Kamphausen said:
but the notion that it is a religious holiday is more or less over
Religion, I've always thought, should be a personal concern. So anyone who wants to celebrate Christmas as the birth of Jesus Christ is still fully able to do that in America and do it completely meaningfully.
The rub perhaps for those who are Christian I see is that often they get annoyed at not being able to INSIST that the rest of us honor Dec. 25 in the exact same manner that they honor it. I'm sorry, folks, this is America. Christmas means what it means to me and how I celebrate it is entirely my business. No one should be telling someone else how to celebrate the holiday.
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Quote:
Steve T said:
I've yet to meet a non Christian who gives a shit whether we celebrate Christmas or not.
Hello, my name is Jim. Now we've met. I'm a non-Christian and I care that Christmas is celebrated. I may not view it with the religiosity that others do, but it's still a tradition in Western culture.
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My point was: do you care if others don't celebrate?
Last edited by Steve T; 2004-12-08 12:07 PM.
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I just find it funny that it's called the "holiday" season when it's obvious what the holiday is. I mean, when was the last time you saw Kwanzaa decorations on your street?
I don't want to see Christmas outlawed just because some people don't celebrate it.
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Quote:
Steve T said:
My point was: do you care if others don't celebrate?
Of course I do not care if others do or do not celebrate it.
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NurikoK98 said:
I just find it funny that it's called the "holiday" season when it's obvious what the holiday is. I mean, when was the last time you saw Kwanzaa decorations on your street?
Christmas, Chanukkah, and Kwanzaa are all celebrated this month. So, "holiday season" is not at all out of line.
Quote:
I don't want to see Christmas outlawed just because some people don't celebrate it.
Don't sweat it. It won't happen.
Last edited by Jim Jackson; 2004-12-08 12:33 PM.
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The big problem with the "holiday" season is that some, expecially some in the public school system seem to think that means every holiday except Christmas:
Public elementary schools in parts of Arizona will perform Hanukkah, Kwanzaa and even some Ramadan music during their winter celebrations -- even though the latter has been over for a couple weeks -- but they wont be singing about herald angels or towns named Bethlehem or a certain little guy born there.
In an effort to be more inclusive of an increasingly diverse student population, most holiday programs will avoid carols that that mention deities or the Nativity events.
"We do traditional songs, not religious songs," said Diane Spero, music teacher at CASY Country Day charter school in Scottsdale. "We don’t do religious songs at all."
This, even though they rarely get complaints and that it’s perfectly legal to include religious music as long as the overall program is balanced. They just don’t want to go there, they say.
"We just pick a theme that has nothing to do with the holidays," said Syd Hoffman, principal at Bright Beginnings charter school in Chandler. "We just stay away from it."
I'm sorry, but if you won't allow Christmas songs under the "separation of church and state" theory, you shouldn't be allowing songs from other religions.
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The great thing for me was our choir directer did nothing but Christain Chrimas songs, as well as some spirituals throughout the rest of the year. I'd like to have seen someone try and stop her too.
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My spelling isn't perfect, but I think I'm just gonna walk around this year and sing, "Felice Hanukkah... Felice Hanukkah..." Yes, I'm mixing two holidays and two languages. Sue me. 
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More "every religion EXCEPT Christian": KOCO-TV in Oklahoma reports that officials with a school district in that state removed the Christian bits from an elementary school play about December holidays because they were worried someone might complain.
Superintendent Karl Springer removed the nativity scene and a rendition of Silent Night from the fifth-grade program at Lakehoma Elementary School in Mustang, Okla. He left in portions of the program that featured traditions such as Kwanzaa and Chanukah.
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Interesting since Oklahoma is a Red state... 
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It must be one of the "blue" counties.
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Why don't you find out for sure?
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I'm not sure its relevant.
To be honest, I've seen school officials in red counties do some pretty stupid things, largely because school officials tend to be liberal no matter where they are.
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Well, you posted the link, so I presumed you would care...Of course, if the county is a Red county, a bit of egg on the face, eh?
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I don't see where I brought up these as being a red or blue state issue in the first place.
You seem to be trying to make a point, but I'm not sure what.
Are expressing shock that liberal asses might also exist in "red" counties? That would be like me assuming there are no republicans in blue counties.
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I don't get why people assume we non-Christians would be offended by Christmas. Did anyone think of asking us "hey, does all this Christmas stuff bother you?" I'm willing to bet that a vast majority of us, if not all, would say "no, Christmas stuff doesn't bother us at all."
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Quote:
Darknight613 said:
I don't get why people assume we non-Christians would be offended by Christmas. Did anyone think of asking us "hey, does all this Christmas stuff bother you?" I'm willing to bet that a vast majority of us, if not all, would say "no, Christmas stuff doesn't bother us at all."
I recognise this, unfortunately the politically correct, "hey let's oppress the majority for a change" crwod wants to assume that everyone is offended by Christianity. This just goes to show where the true biggotry lies.
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Quote:
NurikoK98 said:
I just find it funny that it's called the "holiday" season when it's obvious what the holiday is. I mean, when was the last time you saw Kwanzaa decorations on your street?
I don't want to see Christmas outlawed just because some people don't celebrate it.
But it looks like some people want to push us in that direction anyhow. 
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wannabuyamonkey said:
This just goes to show where the true biggotry lies.
Bigotry is not exclusive to the faithless or the faithful. Both groups have their share of bigots.
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From the the Siskiyou Daily News. Students at a high school in California who were told they could not paint a Nativity scene on a school window as part of an annual holiday decoration effort argued and eventually won their case.
The students at Weed High School by tradition paint windows for the holidays to compete for spirit points. Senior class president Becky James and her classmates wanted to paint a simple Nativity on a small window at the entrance of the school, but were told they couldn’t.
When student body president Jessica Hofer heard about it, she balked.
"I thought that the ruling of no Nativity set was unfair, especially when one class had 'Happy Kwanzaa' approved and another class a Menorah," Hofer said. "To say you can't have a Christian symbol at Christmas but allow other religious symbols is discrimination."
Hofer provided Principal Mike Matheson with a copy of a 1989 Supreme Court ruling that allows student initiated free expression of religion at school.
"Our First Amendment rights give us freedom of religion, not freedom from religion," Hofer said. "Mr. Matheson said he would allow the Nativity scene if we took a poll of the class and the seniors were for it. We did, and 43 of our 45 seniors signed it saying they were in favor of the Nativity scene. Two seniors were absent that day."
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Idiots. Just more proof that this country is becoming more anti Christian with every day.
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i realise this might not be the most appropriate time, but do you have the official guestlist for this years con?
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Many of these anti-Christmas stories seem to be either not true at all or exagerated. It seems to be a theme this year among conservative pundits.
Fair play!
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Quote:
MisterJLA said:
I prefer Thanksmas...
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