|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9
1 post
|
|
1 post
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9 |
Back a while ago when I was in 6th grade there was a Science teacher that use to show videos with a guy named Dr. Kent Hovind or Dr. Dino and these videos tried to show the flaws of Evolution. Later on I looked up Kent Hovind and discovered that his arguments have been proven false. I felt pissed off and I was annoyed that the teacher had shown those videos and been sarcastic about Evolution when he probably knew that he was spreading lies. I don't think that it's fair that teachers talk about Creation just because of their beliefs. It would be a lot nicer if they'd just let kids decide what theory they prefer and want to believe in. I think that Evolution is a much more valid theory 'cause of all the fossils that scientists have discovered over the years. Lucy is definitely an example. Your thoughts?
"We all go a little mad sometimes . . ." - Norman Bates
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
|
|
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308 |
I think its better to believe in fact (evolution) than stories in some made up book that was written 40-60 years after the supposed events happened.
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 232
200+ posts
|
|
200+ posts
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 232 |
Jut as a sie note, the Mayan calendar ends in 7 years. So if you couple that fact with the Christian book of Revelations, the end times are here.
"The British government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa." - George W. Bush State of the Union speech Jan 28, 2003
"mission accomplished" - George W. Bush May 2, 2003
It does not require a majority to prevail but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brushfires in peoples minds". Samuel Adams said that. Pretty deep for a guy that makes beer for a living - The Boondocks
"A conservative is one who admires radicals centuries after they're dead" - Leo C. Rosten
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,949
2500+ posts
|
|
2500+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,949 |
To address the question in your subject...
I do think religion should be allowed to be discussed in public schools for the sake of educating and informing people about what other people and other religions believe. As long as a certain faith or viewpoint is not being imposed on anybody or treated like it's the only right way, I have no problem with religion being discussed.
As for evolution, I really don't see what the big deal is. I consider myself to be a person of faith, and when I was learning about evolution in school, I never felt like that faith was being challenged or threatened. I was learning what other people thought and theorized, and that was all there was to it. I never felt like anyone was saying to me "if you don't believe in evolution, you believe in superstitious nonsense." So it wasn't an issue for me.
Besides, I'm one of those people who believes that science helps prove G-d's existence. There's a specific, artistic order to the universe, and I can't accept the idea that it just happened by chance. There had to be a higher power at work pulling the strings and painting on a canvas. So I don't see religion and science as enemies or rivals.
Last edited by Darknight613; 2005-02-28 12:14 AM.
"Well when I talk to people I don't have to worry about spelling." - wannabuyamonkey
"If Schumacher’s last effort was the final nail in the coffin then Year One would’ve been the crazy guy who stormed the graveyard, dug up the coffin and put a bullet through the franchise’s corpse just to make sure." -- From a review of Darren Aronofsky & Frank Miller's "Batman: Year One" script
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
|
|
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7 |
Quote:
rex said:
I think its better to believe in fact (evolution) than stories in some made up book that was written 40-60 years after the supposed events happened.
Rexy baby, evolution is not fact. Despite popular belief due to mass exhibition, evolution is not proven, and is on shakey grounds not only in theory but also in reputation.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 16,240
Kisser Of John Byrne Ass 15000+ posts
|
|
Kisser Of John Byrne Ass 15000+ posts
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 16,240 |
Adaptation is proven though. they just haven't solved punctuated equilibrium. Although it may have something to do with Christian Bale.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
|
|
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7 |
Oh yeah, speaking for the Vatican, we definitely believe in Natural Selection, but physical structure evolution is way too hard to swallow.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 22,618
Your death will make me king! 15000+ posts
|
|
Your death will make me king! 15000+ posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 22,618 |
Quote:
Pariah said:
Rexy baby, evolution is not fact. Despite popular belief due to mass exhibition, evolution is not proven, and is on shakey grounds not only in theory but also in reputation.
Replace evolution with Creationism and your argument would be even more valid.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
|
|
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308 |
And please never call me baby again.
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
|
|
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7 |
Quote:
Wednesday said:
Replace evolution with Creationism and your argument would be even more valid.
Back up evolution with facts and this statement will have more merit.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
|
|
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7 |
Quote:
rex said:
And please never call me baby again.
No.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
|
|
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308 |
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 14,203
1 Millionth Customer 10000+ posts
|
|
1 Millionth Customer 10000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 14,203 |
Evolution is at least based upon observation not faith.
Bow ties are coool.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9
1 post
|
|
1 post
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9 |
Quote:
Pariah said:
Quote:
Wednesday said:
Replace evolution with Creationism and your argument would be even more valid.
Back up evolution with facts and this statement will have more merit.
Transitional fossils have been found, people have changed over the years, and everything in religion could easily be an explanation from people without our knowledge who thought of a way of how we got here and wrote it down. Transitional fossils can easily be considered as proof of Evolution.
"We all go a little mad sometimes . . ." - Norman Bates
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
|
|
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308 |
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
|
|
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7 |
Quote:
Jason Voorhees said:
Transitional fossils have been found, people have changed over the years, and everything in religion could easily be an explanation from people without our knowledge who thought of a way of how we got here and wrote it down. Transitional fossils can easily be considered as proof of Evolution.
Two thirds of those transitional fossils were a hoax and the ones that even came close were/are still disputable. And even if they weren't, that still doesn't change the fact that if evolution were true, there would be thousands upon thousands of transitions based upon the timeline first dated in early 1900s. They've only discovered a few that haven't even confirmed which transition is placed where on the assumptive evolutionary timeline. And this is all piled onto the fact that based on the terrain changes, we should be accidently discovering these transitions at every corner. There should be fields upon fields of them. But there are none.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
|
|
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7 |
Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
Evolution is at least based upon observation not faith.
Creationism itself isn't simply a belief that pays homage to a God. It just says that whatever created us drew up an outline that would remain static for thousands of years. Of course we Catholics believe that outline was drawn up God, but that doesn't mean that the term itself should be interpreted as such by everyone (of course I believe it should be, but those skeptical of God anyway don't have to).
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
|
|
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308 |
Quote:
Pariah said:
Two thirds of those transitional fossils were a hoax
Thats gotta be the funniest thing you've ever said.
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
|
|
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7 |
Please Rex. Prove me wrong. Just look over the cases where these "transitions" were found and studied.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
|
|
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308 |
Maybe tomorow. I too busy tonight.
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9
1 post
|
|
1 post
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9 |
Even if some were a hoax there are quite a few that can be considered as proof of Evolution. http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/specimen.htmlThat link gives lots of info on valid fossils that have been discovered. And you say that we'd find tons of fossils if Evolution was true but consider how fragile they would be after such a long period of time. It's not an easy task to find transitional fossils since lots of times they're scattered and they can go undiscovered.
"We all go a little mad sometimes . . ." - Norman Bates
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
|
|
The conscience of the rkmbs! 15000+ posts
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,833 Likes: 7 |
Yeah, I've read up on all of those prior. They've been deemed too few and too fractured to be conclusive.
And as for the bones being fragile: That's not true. The claimed to be missing links found over the years were rock solid and the individual pieces were in no danger of breaking. Same definitely goes for the Dinosaurs, their bones were not fragile.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 4,205
fudge 4000+ posts
|
|
fudge 4000+ posts
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 4,205 |
I had "Christianity" when I was in public school, it was later changed to "Religion"
Though I do not believe in the divine I had no problem with learning about religion. I found it interesting and educating. And I was even lucky to have a teacher who was objective about the various religions, no biased comments, not one!
Basically I have no problem with children learning about religion in school. In fact I think it should be compulsory, but the education should not be based on religion.
 Racks be to MisterJLA
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 14,203
1 Millionth Customer 10000+ posts
|
|
1 Millionth Customer 10000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 14,203 |
listen to Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds.
Great song that I guess has something to do with evolution and the missing link.
Bow ties are coool.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 22,618
Your death will make me king! 15000+ posts
|
|
Your death will make me king! 15000+ posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 22,618 |
Quote:
Pariah said:
Yeah, I've read up on all of those prior. They've been deemed too few and too fractured to be conclusive.
By who?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
|
|
Who will I break next? 15000+ posts
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 46,308 |
Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
listen to Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds.
Great song that I guess has something to do with evolution and the missing link.
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32,001 Likes: 1
We already are 15000+ posts
|
|
We already are 15000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32,001 Likes: 1 |
so now the Beatles are eductaors? 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,030
6000+ posts
|
|
6000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,030 |
I thought the thread was about discussing Religion in school, not (yet another) debate on Evolution.
Should religion be discussed in schools? Of course. You can't fully get any kind of a handle on History without discussing religion. You can't appreciate THE SCARLET LETTER without some presentation on the Puritan faith. You can't examine William Blake's poetry without discussing his Christian faith.
The line, I think, not to cross is when the discussion turns toward an attempt by the Instructor to *advocate* a theology.
We all wear a green carnation.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32,001 Likes: 1
We already are 15000+ posts
|
|
We already are 15000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32,001 Likes: 1 |
My goodness........Jim......first you steer this thread that was spiralling towards disaster back on topic!.......Then you counter with the perfect solution to the debate..................You keep this up you'll be moderator by the end of the week.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,030
6000+ posts
|
|
6000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,030 |
Quote:
PJP said:
You keep this up ....
Just send money.
We all wear a green carnation.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32,001 Likes: 1
We already are 15000+ posts
|
|
We already are 15000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 32,001 Likes: 1 |
The check is in the mail my friend!
I also threw in a Reds cap too! They are going to the World Series you know!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,251
6000+ posts
|
|
6000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,251 |
Quote:
Lucy is definitely an example. Your thoughts?
You're the 1% who experiences what believers in intellegent design theory have experienced. You say you want kids to make up there own minds, but you don't seem to be bothered by the fact that 99% of classes teach evolution as though it were fact or teh only viable option. I too saw a video in highschool that turned out to be false. The topic? Lucy! Lucy was deemed by other evolutionists to be nothing more than an oranutang (you can spell check that for me). So I can't help but laugh because one poor evolutionist kid had to hear about intellegent design theory. I take that as seriously as a white guy saying taxis refused to pick him up.
Putting the "fun" back in Fundamentalist Christian Dogma.
" I know God exists because WBAM told me so. " - theory9
JLA brand RACK points = 514k 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 17,801
terrible podcaster 15000+ posts
|
|
terrible podcaster 15000+ posts
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 17,801 |
Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
Evolution is at least based upon observation not faith.
Careful. Observation of isolated incidents and conjectures dependent upon related conjectures. For the fossil record to work in all cases, for example, strata would have to be identical everywhere in the world, which is quite simply impossible near fault lines and atop subduction zones and similar places, not to mention places where existing strata have been radically altered by volcanism, impacts from space, and so on. Ultimately, there are enough holes in macroevolution that much of it has to be taken on faith as well.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 17,801
terrible podcaster 15000+ posts
|
|
terrible podcaster 15000+ posts
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 17,801 |
Quote:
r3x29yz4a said:
listen to Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds.
Great song that I guess has something to do with evolution and the missing link.
After the fact. The Australopithecus (sp?) fossil found was named 'Lucy' in reference to the song, but quite frankly that little ditty has way more to do with drugs (surprise!) than anything else. 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,030
6000+ posts
|
|
6000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,030 |
This ain't no darwin!
This ain't no party!
This ain't no disco!
This ain't no fooling around!
We all wear a green carnation.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9
1 post
|
|
1 post
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 9 |
Quote:
wannabuyamonkey said:
Quote:
Lucy is definitely an example. Your thoughts?
You're the 1% who experiences what believers in intellegent design theory have experienced. You say you want kids to make up there own minds, but you don't seem to be bothered by the fact that 99% of classes teach evolution as though it were fact or teh only viable option. I too saw a video in highschool that turned out to be false. The topic? Lucy! Lucy was deemed by other evolutionists to be nothing more than an oranutang (you can spell check that for me). So I can't help but laugh because one poor evolutionist kid had to hear about intellegent design theory. I take that as seriously as a white guy saying taxis refused to pick him up.
Why shouldn't Evolution be taught when it does have some evidence while religion does not have any at all.
EDIT
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/a_piths.html
Nope Lucy is not deemed a orangutan.
Last edited by Jason Voorhees; 2005-02-28 7:21 PM.
"We all go a little mad sometimes . . ." - Norman Bates
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,251
6000+ posts
|
|
6000+ posts
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,251 |
Quote:
Jason Voorhees said:
Quote:
wannabuyamonkey said:
Quote:
Lucy is definitely an example. Your thoughts?
You're the 1% who experiences what believers in intellegent design theory have experienced. You say you want kids to make up there own minds, but you don't seem to be bothered by the fact that 99% of classes teach evolution as though it were fact or teh only viable option. I too saw a video in highschool that turned out to be false. The topic? Lucy! Lucy was deemed by other evolutionists to be nothing more than an oranutang (you can spell check that for me). So I can't help but laugh because one poor evolutionist kid had to hear about intellegent design theory. I take that as seriously as a white guy saying taxis refused to pick him up.
Why shouldn't Evolution be taught when it does have some evidence while religion does not have any at all.
EDIT
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/a_piths.html
No, Lucy is still deemed as a bipedal.
There is no evidence of intelegent design whatsoever? Gee, I guess you would know, because after all you have a link that proves Lucy was a biped. (Orangutans are bipeds) Also I didn't say evolution shouldn't be taught. Did you read your science books with the same scrutiny you read my post? I simply pointed out your hypocracy in that you think one unprovable theory should be taught and not the other, but then out of the other side of your mouth you claim kids should be able to choose. I think what you meant was kids should be able to choose to agree with your position. i won't bother to share any "evidence" of intelegent design because clearly you know everything you need to know and don't need to learn anymore. Congradulations on achiving what so few do.
Putting the "fun" back in Fundamentalist Christian Dogma.
" I know God exists because WBAM told me so. " - theory9
JLA brand RACK points = 514k
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 14,203
1 Millionth Customer 10000+ posts
|
|
1 Millionth Customer 10000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 14,203 |
Quote:
PJP said:
so now the Beatles are eductaors?
Its a joke. The scientists who discovered Lucy were listening to the song at the time.
Bow ties are coool.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 17,801
terrible podcaster 15000+ posts
|
|
terrible podcaster 15000+ posts
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 17,801 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 14,203
1 Millionth Customer 10000+ posts
|
|
1 Millionth Customer 10000+ posts
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 14,203 |
Quote:
Captain Sammitch said:
See? Drugs!
drugs? see!
Bow ties are coool.
|
|
|
|
|
