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I heard they were planning to digitally add bat-ears to the character to make it an official sequel.
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i'd buy that!
seriously though the saint with a few adjustments woulda been like a great homage to the denny oneil stories where batman would be disgused doing espionage like stuff
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you mean "holy shit bat-man! i agree!"
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ownea of a loneahly heart!
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I like it when people agree!
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big_pimp_tim-made it cool to roll in the first damn place! Mon Jun 11 2007 09:27 PM- harley finally rolled with me "I'm working with him...he's young but, there is much potential. He can apprentice with me and then he's yours for final training. He will remember the face of his father... Some day, Knutreturns just may be the greatest of us all...."-THE bastard
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Saw it yesterday. I really liked it. Very well thought out and done. I'd like to see it again just to see if I can make out who's who in what scene.
whomod said: I generally don't like it when people decide to play by the rules against people who don't play by the rules. It tends to put you immediately at a disadvantage and IMO is a sign of true weakness. This is true both in politics and on the internet." Our Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man said: "no, the doctor's right. besides, he has seniority."
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Likewise, I want to see it again cause it was that much fun of a movie. Nolan can do no wrong.
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I finally saw The Prestige. Amazing. Had to watch it a second time to, like Doc said, try and figure out who was who in each scene. I'm still not sure. Thing is, the method is staring us right in the face throughout the movie, but unless we know what to look for, we don't see it because we don't want to see it. Of course, now I see it, because they told me what it was. Damn.
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yeah thats the beauty of it. i especially like how micheal caine is telling him through the whole movie how he does the trick but he just doesnt wanna belive it....
big_pimp_tim-made it cool to roll in the first damn place! Mon Jun 11 2007 09:27 PM- harley finally rolled with me "I'm working with him...he's young but, there is much potential. He can apprentice with me and then he's yours for final training. He will remember the face of his father... Some day, Knutreturns just may be the greatest of us all...."-THE bastard
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Neither does the audience. I watched it again last night and noticed things that I missed before. Like all the tanks with the dead doubles (I now think one of them was the original Angier). And how when Angier and Borden finally get each others secrets in their hands, they act like they don't care. As obsessed as they were, they still didn't want to see the truth.
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also all of the other subtle hints: the old asian magician who lives his act-Borden . All of the references to killing the birds to get your hands dirty-Angier. The little things like that...
big_pimp_tim-made it cool to roll in the first damn place! Mon Jun 11 2007 09:27 PM- harley finally rolled with me "I'm working with him...he's young but, there is much potential. He can apprentice with me and then he's yours for final training. He will remember the face of his father... Some day, Knutreturns just may be the greatest of us all...."-THE bastard
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Yeah...
I still have to watch the bonus material.
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I liked it a lot, but I wish it hadn't seemed to hinge as much as it did on a single "science fiction" element.
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Quote:
Jeremy said:
Neither does the audience. I watched it again last night and noticed things that I missed before. Like all the tanks with the dead doubles (I now think one of them was the original Angier). And how when Angier and Borden finally get each others secrets in their hands, they act like they don't care. As obsessed as they were, they still didn't want to see the truth.
Of course one was the original!
The only way for the original Angier to survive would have been to clone himself prior to doint the trick, then only ever let the clones do the trick, meaning there would always have to be two Angiers.
Angier (the original) would not have been able to stand by and watch the clones do the trick, as we already saw how badly he hated taking the applause from under the stage!
The original Angier was willing to sacrifice everything for that trick, even his own life, especially as as far as the clones were concerned, they just took over where the previous Angier left off, retaining all their memories!
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Quote:
Nowhereman said:
Angier (the original) would not have been able to stand by and watch the clones do the trick, as we already saw how badly he hated taking the applause from under the stage!
I agree.
And that's also why I think the original Angier was the one who got shot the first time he tried the trick out by himself. The shooter was the clone.
Angier was obsessed with being the man "who comes out of the box." As we saw in the movie, the man who went in the chamber--who started the trick--would go down the trap door and drown. He would never be the man who came out and got the applause. Such a trick, no matter how incredible, would never be good enough for Angier.
Therefore, I think Tesla's device actually teleported the original, and left behind the duplicate.
Further, when we first see him try the trick by himself he puts a gun next to the chamber. At the end of the trick the Angier still in the chamber shoots the "other" Angier. However, right before he does, the "other" Angier starts to say "Wait" and begins to blurt something out before the shooting.
I think what he was going to say was "Wait...I'm the original Angier." (or words to that effect).
Finally, according to Wikipedia's summary of the novel, that is in fact, the case: the machine leaves the duplicate behind and teleports the original. Therefore, the Angier we see after the first time he uses the device is the clone. The original Angier never got to perform the trick in front of an audience, only the clone did.
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This makes little difference, because Angier himself said at the end that every time he did the trick he didn't know if he would drown or be teleported. In other words, Angier himself didn't know if he was a clone or the original. The important thing is that he was willing to risk death for the trick, just as Bale was willing to sacrifice half of his life.
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Quote:
the G-man said:
I think what he was going to say was "Wait...I'm the original Angier." (or words to that effect).
You can somewhat hear that over the gunshot and the narration. Course it could just be the double really thinking he's the original.
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One other thing I like about this film is the character reversal!
All through the film you pretty much feel sympathy for Jackman and despise Bale, but at the very end you suddenly realise Bale is the one you should have been sympathetic to and Jackman was the cunt!
Initially Jackman was the real nice guy, but the main trick in the film for making you carry on sympathising with him and disliking Bale is the fact they never did say what knot Bale tied!
The audience just assumed he had tied the wrong knot!
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That's why that movie fucking rocks.
My review wasn't as in depth as yours....
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Quote:
Nowhereman said:
One other thing I like about this film is the character reversal!
All through the film you pretty much feel sympathy for Jackman and despise Bale, but at the very end you suddenly realise Bale is the one you should have been sympathetic to and Jackman was the cunt!
Yeah. Pretty much. Though an argument could be made that they were both assholes pretty much from day one, given their singular drive to destroy each other ahead of everything: ethics, family, everything.
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I agree that they were both arseholes, but I think the way they wrote the movie tended to make you overlook all the shit Jackman did by having you feel sorry for him.
The death of his wife made you pity him and made you make excuses for his behaviour, but it wasnt til the end of the movie, and the plotline involving Jackman taking Bales daughter, that you suddenly started feeling sympathy for Bale & disgust for Jackman!
Very clever stuff!
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I think you feel for Bale's 'character' because of his duplicitous nature. Spoilers for those who haven't seen it. One brother was a complete ass and caused the death of Jackman's wife (I think the movie seriously implies that he tied the more difficult knot) and was the one who cheated on his wife. The other brother was the one who tried sympathized for Jackman's loss (he couldn't remember what knot was tied because he didn't tie it) and loved his wife and child. And close to death, even the asshole brother was remorsefully about the loss of each of their loved ones who were sacrificed so that they could live their trick. Jackman, on the other hand, didn't care about who he'd hurt anymore. He'd let the game of revenge and ego consume him to the point of murder.
whomod said: I generally don't like it when people decide to play by the rules against people who don't play by the rules. It tends to put you immediately at a disadvantage and IMO is a sign of true weakness. This is true both in politics and on the internet." Our Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man said: "no, the doctor's right. besides, he has seniority."
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Quote:
Nowhereman said:
One other thing I like about this film is the character reversal!
All through the film you pretty much feel sympathy for Jackman and despise Bale, but at the very end you suddenly realize Bale is the one you should have been sympathetic to and Jackman was the cunt!
Initially Jackman was the real nice guy, but the main trick in the film for making you carry on sympathizing with him and disliking Bale is the fact they never did say what knot Bale tied!
The audience just assumed he had tied the wrong knot!
I sympathized with Jackman up till the point where he shot Bale. At that point I saw who the real asshole was, although I did not understand why Bale kept saying he did not know which knot he tied. Bale was not looking to screw with Jackman until Jackman began screwing with him. Bale didn't try to rip off Jackman's greatest trick, yet Jackman stole Bale's greatest trick for his own. To me, there was never any doubt which character was to be given sympathy. It was always Bale.
As for Bale never saying which not he tied, I think the Doctor is correct. The Bale that Jackman kept asking was, unfortunately for him, the Bale that did not know (and probably did not want to know). It was poor luck for Jackman that he kept running into the wrong one.
Last edited by Brad Lee; 2007-04-05 5:46 AM.
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I totally disagree with what you are saying about the sympathy.
When Jackman shot Bale he was still torn up by grief, which made you feel to a degree, that his actions were justified.
At that point he didnt become an arsehole.
Same with the stealing of the trick.
As far as Jackman is concerned, and the audience for the most part, Jackman is stealing Bales trick because we believe that Bale took Jackmans wife from him.
Its only after you know the ending of the film that you would see Jackman as an arsehole for those two acts!
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Are you questioning how I felt about the characters? Because that's how I felt about the characters, as the film was happening. I sympathized with Bale from the beginning because he was only doing what he was told by Jackman's wife. It's what she wanted him to do. They got burned, and she died. It tore him up inside because at that point he knew he should have listened to Caine.
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I watched this last week. Great movie but the ending confused the hell out of me. I need to watch it a couple more times.
November 6th, 2012: Americas new Independence Day.
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Just read the rest of this thread, it explains it all.
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Are you questioning how I felt about the characters? Because that's how I felt about the characters, as the film was happening. I sympathized with Bale from the beginning because he was only doing what he was told by Jackman's wife. It's what she wanted him to do. They got burned, and she died. It tore him up inside because at that point he knew he should have listened to Caine. I'm glad you dont post here anymore, you fucking tool.
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