An NAACP leader said Michael Vick should be allowed to return to the NFL, preferably the Atlanta Falcons, after serving his sentence for his role in a dogfighting operation.
R.L. White, president of the group's Atlanta chapter said the Falcons quarterback made a mistake and should be allowed to prove he has learned from that mistake.
On Monday, Vick said through a lawyer that he will plead guilty to a federal charge of conspiracy to travel in interstate commerce in aid of unlawful activities and conspiracy to sponsor a dog in an animal fighting venture.
Three Vick associates have pleaded guilty to the conspiracy charge and say Vick provided nearly all the gambling and operating funds for the "Bad Newz Kennels" dogfighting enterprise. Two of them also said Vick participated in executing at least eight underperforming dogs, raising the possibility of the animal cruelty charges.
Remember when the NAACP was about insuring equal rights for people? These days its little more than a lobbying group for every skeevy famous (and sometimes not so famous) criminal who just happens to be black: Vick, Michael Jackson, OJ, R Kelly, that stripper who lied about getting raped at Duke, etc.
"At this point, you're not looking at guilt or innocence," White said, referring to the possible harsher sentence Vick could have received had he taken his case to trial and been found guilty. "You're thinking, 'What I better do is cut my losses and take a plea.' But if he saw this as the best thing to do at this point for his future, then I think he made the correct choice."
Actually, pleading guilty means... you are guilty.
The apologist assholes couldn't be more delusional if they tried.
The daily show the other day was ripping the sports channels because they were all discussing the big concern over whether he would rat out other players. Because that would be bad. Apparently moreso than the cruel dog fighting.
Take some trading cards picturing a disgraced NFL superstar. Add some dog slobber and teethmarks. What do you get? The most valuable Michael Vick cards _ by far _ on eBay, that's what.
Collector Rochelle Steffen of Cape Girardeau, Mo., gave every Vick card she owned to her dogs and let them go to town on the images of the Atlanta Falcons quarterback who is scheduled to plead guilty to a federal dogfighting charge Monday.
Once Monte, her 6-year-old Weimaraner, and Roxie, her Great Dane puppy, were done worrying them, nearly two dozen $1-$10 cards were crumpled, crimped, chewed, torn and generally in a sorry state. Some even had corners missing.
As of Thursday evening, the highest bid on the lot of 22 cards had risen to $455 and more than 2,000 people had viewed the posting. Seventy-seven people already have bid on the auction, which ends Sunday.
The next-most expensive Vick cards _ well-preserved specimens from his rookie year _ were going for less than half the price of the gnawed ones.
"If I would have had some of his super-duper ones, they would have been right in the mix too," Steffen said Thursday.
She plans to donate the winning bid money to the humane society of the bidder's choice.
Since Vick was indicted on federal dogfighting charges last month, former fans have donated Vick jerseys to dog shelters, while others have tried to cash in by selling Vick T-shirts and chew toys for dogs.
"I'm not angry toward him; my anger is toward anyone who would do this to animals," said Steffen, a college student and artist who wrote a note accompanying her auction to explain it was artistic expression.
"I mean no harm to anyone involved with this auction," she wrote.
Vick said through a lawyer this week he will plead guilty to a federal charge of conspiracy to travel in interstate commerce in aid of unlawful activities and conspiracy to sponsor a dog in an animal fighting venture.
Steffen's cards join a collection of newly released items on sale. T-shirts are being sold online with slogans that say "Ignorance Breeds Ignorance. Neuter Mike Vick," and "ConVICKt" and others that show dogs urinating on footballs and jerseys.
A few fans also have released "Free Vick" shirts.
The St. Paul Saints, a minor league baseball team known for campy promotions, gave out Vick chew toys Tuesday to the first 15,000 fans with some game proceeds going to the Humane Society. Fans got the St. Paul pig mascot with a No. 7 printed on the back and a tag around its neck with Vick's picture.
The Atlanta Humane Society also has reported former Vick fans mailing in jerseys _ often accompanied by financial contributions and letters of outrage over the charges. Those former fans have suggested the Falcons jerseys become animal bedding or rags to help scrub up the messes that dogs leave behind. Other branches of the Humane Society have said they'll take donated Vick items to resell on eBay.
Steffen said she hopes to bring more attention to the abuse of animals involved in dogfighting activities.
"The money donated to local shelters makes this whole idea of selling the cards worthwhile," she said.
It should be noted that the NAACP hasn't officially taken a position on Vick. Their head guy has actually been making the rounds saying Vick is not a victim. So it's really misleading to portray one person's comments as being representative of the whole group.
Remember when the NAACP was about insuring equal rights for people? These days its little more than a lobbying group for every skeevy famous (and sometimes not so famous) criminal who just happens to be black: Vick, Michael Jackson, OJ, R Kelly, that stripper who lied about getting raped at Duke, etc.
Another apparent example of the NAACP circling the wagons around someone just because they're black:
Controversial minister Jeremiah Wright will speak at the Detroit branch of the NAACP 53rd Annual Fight for Freedom Fund dinner. . . .
The Fight for Freedom dinner, which annually attracts about 10,000 people, will be held April 27 at Cobo Hall. The gathering is a key fund-raiser for the Detroit Branch NAACP, and is billed as the largest sit-down dinner in the country.
The NAACP needs to get it through their head: Wright is under attack not for the color of his skin, but for the content of his ideas. To defend him is to countenance those ideas.
Through its actions, the NAACP is in effect arguing that anti-Americanism is acceptable, so long as its source is black. The association is sanctioning both invidious ideas and an invidious racial double standard.
I think you need to get it through your head first that calling the U.S. out for it's racist past and present is not "anti-Americanism".
And you Republicans wonder why you fail to attract any sizable percentage of minorities. It's because you DO NOT WANT TO UNDERSTAND, much less own up to the idea that there is anything to answer for as far as race goes.
And really, don't et me wrong. it's actually fine by me. it's just more votes for your party to lose.
BTW, no one but the far right gives a fuck about Jeremiah Wright. Which I think in and of itself should tell you something.
To be fair, there's no real point in denying anything on these boards. People can deny whatever they want and their accusers will still claim "you're wrong, I'm Wright."
This is not vengeance. This is pun-ishment.
"The goodness of the true pun is in the direct ratio of its intolerability." — Edgar Allan Poe
BTW, no one but the far right gives a fuck about Jeremiah Wright. Which I think in and of itself should tell you something.
Yeah, that's exactly why the NAACP invited him. Because no one give a fuck.
whomod said: I generally don't like it when people decide to play by the rules against people who don't play by the rules. It tends to put you immediately at a disadvantage and IMO is a sign of true weakness. This is true both in politics and on the internet."
wondy, are you aware that "allah" is just the arabic word for god? the same abrahamic god you worship. so saying praise allah as a slur makes little sense.
in fact wondy you seem to be salivating at each chance to trash obama. it's as if there were something about him that you already hated but couldn't talk about.. and now you have some trivial speech that someone made which you can use as an excuse to vent your white rage. it's kind of sad more than anything else, like most things involving you.
Originally Posted By: Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man
wondy, are you aware that "allah" is just the arabic word for god? the same abrahamic god you worship. so saying praise allah as a slur makes little sense.
Allah is a word used by Koran-based believers in God, with beliefs in Jihad, Honor-killing, and basically murdering anyone who doesn't believe exactly what they do.
Yahweh (or Holy Father) is the Abrahamic god. No one who follows the Abrahamic God asserts a belief in murdering non-Christians or non-Jews, or any similar equivalent of Jihad.
Muslims believe that God's blessing was passed on to Ishmael (illegitimate son of Abraham) and his descendants, the Arabs.
The Bible (in Genesis) teaches that God's blessing was given to Isaac (legitimate son of Abraham and his wife) and his descendants, the Israelites (or Jews).
You once again are clearly incorrect in what you allege.
Originally Posted By: Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man
in fact wondy you seem to be salivating at each chance to trash obama. it's as if there were something about him that you already hated but couldn't talk about.. and now you have some trivial speech that someone made which you can use as an excuse to vent your white rage. it's kind of sad more than anything else, like most things involving you.
I do no more than point out the veil of lies surrounding Obama's fraudulent projected image of being a moderate trying to bring the nation together and find the common ground.
You want to see salivating and gloating, and attacking at every opportunity, just look at Whomod's posts for the last few days, on the Hillary Clinton '08 topic, or any number of other topics where he gleefully leaps on every last insult and allegation directed at Bush.
Or perhaps you should just look in the mirror, at your obsessive raging at every post I make.
Originally Posted By: Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man
wondy, are you aware that "allah" is just the arabic word for god? the same abrahamic god you worship. so saying praise allah as a slur makes little sense.
Allah is a word used by Koran-based believers in God, with beliefs in Jihad, Honor-killing, and basically murdering anyone who doesn't believe exactly what they do.
Yahweh (or Holy Father) is the Abrahamic god. No one who follows the Abrahamic God asserts a belief in murdering non-Christians or non-Jews, or any similar equivalent of Jihad.
Muslims believe that God's blessing was passed on to Ishmael (illegitimate son of Abraham) and his descendants, the Arabs.
The Bible (in Genesis) teaches that God's blessing was given to Isaac (legitimate son of Abraham and his wife) and his descendants, the Israelites (or Jews).
You once again are clearly incorrect in what you allege.
well i didn't allege anything. Allah is the Arabic word for God. Regardless of which son got what, no one says it's a different god just different interpretations of said god's wishes. Jews, Christians, and Muslims all think they have it right and the others are wrong. Go back a few hundred years and you'd have Christians running inquisitions and building ghettos because of that belief. And the Christian Bible teaches lots of violent things, things that are ignored in the modern world. But if you look at the harshness and instability of the middle east it's no wonder that some will adhere to those violent teachings in their book. In fact technically they have to use broad interpretations to justify themselves. Islam is very clear that harming innocents is never allowed so then people like bin laden have to twist what the word innocent means, which is no different than someone who shoots an abortion clinic doctor because they twisted the wording in the bible.
Originally Posted By: Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man
Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy
Originally Posted By: Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man
wondy, are you aware that "allah" is just the arabic word for god? the same abrahamic god you worship. so saying praise allah as a slur makes little sense.
Allah is a word used by Koran-based believers in God, with beliefs in Jihad, Honor-killing, and basically murdering anyone who doesn't believe exactly what they do.
Yahweh (or Holy Father) is the Abrahamic god. No one who follows the Abrahamic God asserts a belief in murdering non-Christians or non-Jews, or any similar equivalent of Jihad.
Muslims believe that God's blessing was passed on to Ishmael (illegitimate son of Abraham) and his descendants, the Arabs.
The Bible (in Genesis) teaches that God's blessing was given to Isaac (legitimate son of Abraham and his wife) and his descendants, the Israelites (or Jews).
You once again are clearly incorrect in what you allege.
well i didn't allege anything. Allah is the Arabic word for God. Regardless of which son got what, no one says it's a different god just different interpretations of said god's wishes. Jews, Christians, and Muslims all think they have it right and the others are wrong. Go back a few hundred years and you'd have Christians running inquisitions and building ghettos because of that belief. And the Christian Bible teaches lots of violent things, things that are ignored in the modern world. But if you look at the harshness and instability of the middle east it's no wonder that some will adhere to those violent teachings in their book. In fact technically they have to use broad interpretations to justify themselves. Islam is very clear that harming innocents is never allowed so then people like bin laden have to twist what the word innocent means, which is no different than someone who shoots an abortion clinic doctor because they twisted the wording in the bible.
Or the Westboro Baptist Church protesting the funerals and gloating over the deaths of American troops killed in Iraq. They claim to be Christian, even though most other Christian denominations and evangelists (including Jerry Falwell) consider them and their beliefs to be abhorrent.
Just as there are prominent Muslims who condemn Muslim terrorists for distorting Muslim beliefs.
Should we be cross with Christianity based on Fred Phelps or other Christian extemists the way others judge Islam on account of Islamic terrorists like bin Laden?
This is not vengeance. This is pun-ishment.
"The goodness of the true pun is in the direct ratio of its intolerability." — Edgar Allan Poe
well i didn't allege anything. Allah is the Arabic word for God. Regardless of which son got what, no one says it's a different god just different interpretations of said god's wishes. Jews, Christians, and Muslims all think they have it right and the others are wrong. Go back a few hundred years and you'd have Christians running inquisitions and building ghettos because of that belief. And the Christian Bible teaches lots of violent things, things that are ignored in the modern world. But if you look at the harshness and instability of the middle east it's no wonder that some will adhere to those violent teachings in their book. In fact technically they have to use broad interpretations to justify themselves. Islam is very clear that harming innocents is never allowed so then people like bin laden have to twist what the word innocent means, which is no different than someone who shoots an abortion clinic doctor because they twisted the wording in the bible.
The difference, as you well know, is that millions of muslims cheer in the street at news of 9-11, or cheer news of dead israelis from a suicide bombing or missile attack. Islam alone teaches violent Jihad, and an assured place in heaven and 70 virgins if you die killing the enemies of Islam.
The Crusades were a defensive war, against centuries of harassment and terretorial loss to muslim expansion into the formerly Christian Middle East and North Africa, and into Italy, Spain, Portugal, Southern France and the Balkans. In an age where printed Bibles and literacy were rare, these european re-conquests and advances into Lebanon and Palestine were not so much scriptural as nationalist, and often, a search for adventure in travelling to distant lands.
As I pointed out many times with a Washington Post story I quoted often, about 40 to 50% of Muslims in most islamic countries began boycotting U.S. products and businesses after 9-11, in solidarity with the terrorists. Despite that their own leaders told them it will hurt their own economies far worse than it will hurt ours.
In contrast, when someone bombs an abortion clinic, close to 100% of Christians will condemn that action as insanity, and completely non-biblical. A striking contrast to the widespead endorsement of religious violence in the islamic world.
In your irrational hatred of Christianity, you try to paint it as no different from islamic faith. But Christianity is an inherently peaceful religion, whereas Islam is inherently violent in how it spreads, and intimidates those who don't share their islamic beliefs.
Why are right wingers so obsessed about San Fransisco?
Gay issues aside (and I note that you're the one who brought those up), SF is widely perceived by everyone but the most out of touch leftist as the most liberal large city in America.
The difference, as you well know, is that millions of muslims cheer in the street at news of 9-11, or cheer news of dead israelis from a suicide bombing or missile attack.
so what? Have you ever seen a soccer riot, or a football riot, or Mardi Gras? Do you understand mob mentality and how people just join in with the group?
Quote:
Islam alone teaches violent Jihad, and an assured place in heaven and 70 virgins if you die killing the enemies of Islam.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/religion/Story/0,2763,631357,00.html Read it, interesting article. The muslims are like Klingons. They may have lots of violent bloodthirsty assholes giving them a bad name, but if you get down to the actual text of what they believe, it's all about honor and decency and following god. You and them are not as different as you think. Accept the fact that there are violent christians and then realize that maybe there are muslims like you; crazy but harmless. then you may even realize there are muslims who are decent people who believe in the peace and love and blah blah that the abrahamic religions cram in between stories of gore.
Quote:
The Crusades were a defensive war, against centuries of harassment and terretorial loss to muslim expansion into the formerly Christian Middle East and North Africa, and into Italy, Spain, Portugal, Southern France and the Balkans. In an age where printed Bibles and literacy were rare, these european re-conquests and advances into Lebanon and Palestine were not so much scriptural as nationalist, and often, a search for adventure in travelling to distant lands.
and those Christians originated in the middle east? in all of those countries it was just a bunch of happy christians sitting around hanging out until those big bad muslims did the unthinkable and expanded their empire? Jeez, aren't you the guy who defended the slaughter of the indians because they were "inferior"? It's not such a fun philosophy when the other guys think they're also superior, is it?
Quote:
As I pointed out many times with a Washington Post story I quoted often, about 40 to 50% of Muslims in most islamic countries began boycotting U.S. products and businesses after 9-11, in solidarity with the terrorists. Despite that their own leaders told them it will hurt their own economies far worse than it will hurt ours.
So what? A boycott is actually pretty American of them. If I boycott red meat because I don't like the way the industry is run does that mean that I am involved in some plot to blow up a mcdonalds? People do stupid things, people do whiny things, people try and make statements. I would think you'd be happy that so many muslims opposed the US and did a peaceful protest statement instead of an act of violence.
Quote:
In contrast, when someone bombs an abortion clinic, close to 100% of Christians will condemn that action as insanity, and completely non-biblical. A striking contrast to the widespead endorsement of religious violence in the islamic world.
But do you ever consider that we're getting the news that is deemed of interest to an american audience? I would not be surprised if overseas the bulk of media coverage on American christians is of pat robertson and jerry fallwell talking about liberals and feminists being to blame for 9/11. Just because they do a news story showing one mad muslim and follow it with statistics about similar sentiments does not mean they're all likeminded any more than all christians think the exact same thoughts or have the exact same interpretation on the bible.
Quote:
In your irrational hatred of Christianity, you try to paint it as no different from islamic faith. But Christianity is an inherently peaceful religion, whereas Islam is inherently violent in how it spreads, and intimidates those who don't share their islamic beliefs.
you only see it as a hatred of christianity because i don't hold the same hatred of islam that you do. the christians, jews, and muslims are all branches from the same tree believing in the same god. the problems come about through interpretation of your holy texts and centuries of sects forming feuds. I think it's a little sad that you have so much anger and then talk about your faith as being one of peace. it's sad because you don't live up to your own beliefs. a lot of times i just make fun of you because of your comments that i (and many others, still waiting for one person to defend you)find racist, but ultimately i think you must be a very sad and angry man. i hope you appreciate that i put some thought into my responses and that ultimately we're all here on the board for good discussions and opinion. i just hope that you can respond with the same level of respect and not give in to your darker impulses.
The difference, as you well know, is that millions of muslims cheer in the street at news of 9-11, or cheer news of dead israelis from a suicide bombing or missile attack.
Originally Posted By: Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man
so what? Have you ever seen a soccer riot, or a football riot, or Mardi Gras? Do you understand mob mentality and how people just join in with the group?
Wow.
This is, perhaps, one of the most twisted examples of moral relativism I've ever seen: comparing the murder of thousands of innocent people to a sporting event.
The difference, as you well know, is that millions of muslims cheer in the street at news of 9-11, or cheer news of dead israelis from a suicide bombing or missile attack.
Originally Posted By: Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man
so what? Have you ever seen a soccer riot, or a football riot, or Mardi Gras? Do you understand mob mentality and how people just join in with the group?
Wow.
This is, perhaps, one of the most twisted examples of moral relativism I've ever seen: comparing the murder of thousands of innocent people to a sporting event.
Ray, you really need to take a step back.
um...we're not talking about deaths, we're talking about people gathering and cheering. it's not moral relativisim, it's simply pointing to similar reactions not making any comment on what those are reactions to. it's talking about mob mentality being part of human nature. maybe you should get your law student interns at the traffic firm to proofread your posts before you come off like a senile old man...again.
but i love the typical conservative tactic. you find a hidden meaning where none exists and then claim that was the whole point of the argument.
You're the one saying that people gathering and cheering at a sporting event is no different than gathering and cheering over a terrorist attack, Ray.
Like I said, you really need to step back here. Not every bad behavior can be justified, you know.
no, i'm pointing out mob mentality which exists everywhere. people in america have killed viciously after being caught up in mob mentality. and in america there were people who gathered and cheered when we invaded iraq. and they were cheering deaths. and there are many many other events that have been about death and horror that were cheered at by citizens in an opposing nation.
Somehow, I doubt you'd allow "mob mentality" to be used a justification for, say, lynchings in the deep south or that you would compare lynchings to fights at a sporting event.
Originally Posted By: Friendly Neighborhood Ray-man
Originally Posted By: Wonder Boy
The difference, as you well know, is that millions of muslims cheer in the street at news of 9-11, or cheer news of dead israelis from a suicide bombing or missile attack.
so what? Have you ever seen a soccer riot, or a football riot, or Mardi Gras? Do you understand mob mentality and how people just join in with the group?
Quote:
Islam alone teaches violent Jihad, and an assured place in heaven and 70 virgins if you die killing the enemies of Islam.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/religion/Story/0,2763,631357,00.html Read it, interesting article. The muslims are like Klingons. They may have lots of violent bloodthirsty assholes giving them a bad name, but if you get down to the actual text of what they believe, it's all about honor and decency and following god. You and them are not as different as you think. Accept the fact that there are violent christians and then realize that maybe there are muslims like you; crazy but harmless. then you may even realize there are muslims who are decent people who believe in the peace and love and blah blah that the abrahamic religions cram in between stories of gore.
Quote:
The Crusades were a defensive war, against centuries of harassment and terretorial loss to muslim expansion into the formerly Christian Middle East and North Africa, and into Italy, Spain, Portugal, Southern France and the Balkans. In an age where printed Bibles and literacy were rare, these european re-conquests and advances into Lebanon and Palestine were not so much scriptural as nationalist, and often, a search for adventure in travelling to distant lands.
and those Christians originated in the middle east? in all of those countries it was just a bunch of happy christians sitting around hanging out until those big bad muslims did the unthinkable and expanded their empire? Jeez, aren't you the guy who defended the slaughter of the indians because they were "inferior"? It's not such a fun philosophy when the other guys think they're also superior, is it?
Quote:
As I pointed out many times with a Washington Post story I quoted often, about 40 to 50% of Muslims in most islamic countries began boycotting U.S. products and businesses after 9-11, in solidarity with the terrorists. Despite that their own leaders told them it will hurt their own economies far worse than it will hurt ours.
So what? A boycott is actually pretty American of them. If I boycott red meat because I don't like the way the industry is run does that mean that I am involved in some plot to blow up a mcdonalds? People do stupid things, people do whiny things, people try and make statements. I would think you'd be happy that so many muslims opposed the US and did a peaceful protest statement instead of an act of violence.
Quote:
In contrast, when someone bombs an abortion clinic, close to 100% of Christians will condemn that action as insanity, and completely non-biblical. A striking contrast to the widespead endorsement of religious violence in the islamic world.
But do you ever consider that we're getting the news that is deemed of interest to an american audience? I would not be surprised if overseas the bulk of media coverage on American christians is of pat robertson and jerry fallwell talking about liberals and feminists being to blame for 9/11. Just because they do a news story showing one mad muslim and follow it with statistics about similar sentiments does not mean they're all likeminded any more than all christians think the exact same thoughts or have the exact same interpretation on the bible.
Quote:
In your irrational hatred of Christianity, you try to paint it as no different from islamic faith. But Christianity is an inherently peaceful religion, whereas Islam is inherently violent in how it spreads, and intimidates those who don't share their islamic beliefs.
you only see it as a hatred of christianity because i don't hold the same hatred of islam that you do. the christians, jews, and muslims are all branches from the same tree believing in the same god. the problems come about through interpretation of your holy texts and centuries of sects forming feuds. I think it's a little sad that you have so much anger and then talk about your faith as being one of peace. it's sad because you don't live up to your own beliefs. a lot of times i just make fun of you because of your comments that i (and many others, still waiting for one person to defend you)find racist, but ultimately i think you must be a very sad and angry man. i hope you appreciate that i put some thought into my responses and that ultimately we're all here on the board for good discussions and opinion. i just hope that you can respond with the same level of respect and not give in to your darker impulses.
I thought I'd save this collection of anti-American idiot rationalizations of yours, just in case you choose to edit and soften the wording later.
I listed specific examples where muslims, by the tens of millions, endorse terrorism, and as G-man pointed out, you came up with some truly idiot rationalizations, while painting me as some kind of hater for objecting to an islamic religion that breeds a remarkable ratio of murderous fanatics, and tens of millions more who financially contribute to funding jihad, who engage in other forms of muslim intimidation, in boycotting (again: in endorsement of terrorism)or just cheering terrorism on in the streets, or show thir approval with a Bin Ladin poster or screen saver.
And every time, you took sympathy for the intolerance and murderous rationalizations of our enemies, while demonizing me for objecting to their actions.
Liberals who bemoan discrimination, intolerance, restraint of Constitutional freedoms, and promotion of hatred toward various abberant minorities, have absolutely no problem with discriminating against, being intolerant of, restricting Constitutional freedoms of, and directing hate-filled scapegoat rhetoric against conservatives.
EXACTLY what they accuse Republicans/conservatives of doing, is EXACTLY what liberals/Democrats do themselves, to those who oppose their beliefs.
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